The Environment Bandwagon.

[phoenixmystic]

I just thought I would add this one in. I have spent some years
Working on such matters and well the Government just does not have a clue and the things they are doing, professionally speaking are ill advised.

Lets start with the demonising of air travel, some point to consider are:-

1, Only 5% of uk emissions are because of this, compare that to 25% from homes.

2, Per person the air has far less emissions that road transport, so when they stop everyone using planes what do you think they will use then?

To hit the Uk koyto agreement there has been a past surge in the use of CCGT power plants how every the small gas supply they relied on is not almost gone. The most currently available safe alternative is nuclear power. ( yes it is and I know what am talking about and I am aware of nuclear waste before you try and point that out.) The illusion that nuclear is not safe is due to the usual habit of the media mis representing things.

They also assume technology alone can do it. No it can not they needs to be a change in the attitude in what is generally a very selfish and lazy population. what is the point
of trying to cut emissions when you have sub urban moving driving a large 4*4 that sucks up the fuel to move a child a distance they could have walked in 20 minutes? ridiculous and lazy. People also need to be better encouraged to recycle however if the facilities have not been provided to do this again, it will be another part of a wasted budget.

There is a distinct lack of effort to make nations such as the USA join the attempt. Given that is it the most polluting and wasteful place on the planet the efforts of others countries will pale down when the greedy selfish USA goverment continues to pump out the smoke to get a few extra coins at the worlds expense.

As you may have noticed the above half rant is primarily focused on emissions, like the Goverment. It is not my place to say that no nothing about this field but it is obvious. A few people are starting to worry about the enviromentt and so the Goverment jumps on it with a big show, but that show will have little effect, after all it is easier to stop planes than to convince people to be nicer to the environment at homes. It is nothing more than an attempt to win votes by heading to what is popular and then limiting the damages to voters by attacking something like aviation so they do not lose too many, again the environment will lose out. Helping the environment is about more that just emissions and the craft that emit a proportionally small amount for them.

Now the major political parties are saying they care about the environment? If this was true why leave it so late to do anything? People like the green party and environmentalists have been sounding out the warnings for years and they ignored them and even laughed some of them off, and now they are trying to copy (albeit badly) the people they laughed off as hippies out of touch with reality? They know as the Environment becomes a bigger issue people will look to the alternative like the green party so they are trying to steal their steam before too may people become aware of there existence.

Well there it is, my 2 pence worth. BTW yes, I know what I am talking about, no I am not involved with the green party or any environmental group. Yes I am qualified in this field so I am not talking nonsense (that's for those scratching there head about me mentioning nuclear power).

[Kezzer]

First off, stop being so proud of yourself.

BTW yes, I know what I am talking about

Yes I am qualified in this field so I am not talking nonsense

You've got it into your head that we don't believe you before we've even had a chance to reply and just because you've got a qualification in that field, it in no way implies you know what you're talking about. I've got qualifications left, right and center and I know bugger all about those fields.

The reason why they're talking about planes is because a plane gives off a hell of a lot more carbon monoxide into the atmosphere per trip than your average car does. In a single flight a plane can give off five tonnes of carbon monoxide. That's the reason why they're talking about cutting down flights, it's not because they're the majority of the emissions.

This is typical governmental tactics of jumping on whatever popular bandwagon seems to be around at the time. It is a good idea to cut down on the emissions, and aiming at aviations isn't the best approach. It's probably best to aim for "going green" and talking about solar, wind and hydro energy as opposed to cutting out flights. The UK could easily cut down on the amount of cars on the roads per year. There's so many people I know who take their car to work even though they could walk or get the bus at least.

[Sinizter]

The only reason the government suddenly gives a rats **** about global warming is because they just worked out how to tax it.

It was never an issue for them before this.

[kalniel]

Lets start with the demonising of air travel, some point to consider are:-

1, Only 5% of uk emissions are because of this, compare that to 25% from homes.

2, Per person the air has far less emissions that road transport, so when they stop everyone using planes what do you think they will use then?

Perhaps you need to actually look at what the Govt are actually doing. No-one in their right mind could suggest they are trying to stop or even reduce the numbers of people using planes - that's a frankly absurb idea.

To hit the Uk koyto agreement there has been a past surge in the use of CCGT power plants how every the small gas supply they relied on is not almost gone. The most currently available safe alternative is nuclear power. ( yes it is and I know what am talking about and I am aware of nuclear waste before you try and point that out.) The illusion that nuclear is not safe is due to the usual habit of the media mis representing things.

Hang on, I thought you were argueing that the govt had no clue.. isn't it actually the govt who were suggesting using nuclear power..

what is the point of trying to cut emissions when you have sub urban moving driving a large 4*4 that sucks up the fuel to move a child a distance they could have walked in 20 minutes? ridiculous and lazy.

And how much of climate change is due to the small minority of 4x4s in families with children? I think you need some perspective, something you're claiming others don't have

People also need to be better encouraged to recycle however if the facilities have not been provided to do this again, it will be another part of a wasted budget.

Good thing virtually every town now has a pretty good recycling facilities then eh?

There is a distinct lack of effort to make nations such as the USA join the attempt. Given that is it the most polluting and wasteful place on the planet the efforts of others countries will pale down when the greedy selfish USA goverment continues to pump out the smoke to get a few extra coins at the worlds expense.

Of course, emerging nations aren't a problem at all are they? And if others are bad it's ok for us to be bad as well isn't it? We lead by example, not be constantly waiting for someone else to act first.

As you may have noticed the above half rant is primarily focused on emissions, like the Goverment. It is not my place to say that no nothing about this field but it is obvious. A few people are starting to worry about the enviromentt and so the Goverment jumps on it with a big show, but that show will have little effect, after all it is easier to stop planes than to convince people to be nicer to the environment at homes. It is nothing more than an attempt to win votes by heading to what is popular and then limiting the damages to voters by attacking something like aviation so they do not lose too many, again the environment will lose out. Helping the environment is about more that just emissions and the craft that emit a proportionally small amount for them.

Again, where has anything been said about stopping planes? Last I heard they were quite fine with the expansions to UK airports that are currently happening. It's about time the govt jumped on the environment.

[Byatt]

I just thought I would add this one in. I have spent some years
Working on such matters

Yes I am qualified in this field so I am not talking nonsense (that's for those scratching there head about me mentioning nuclear power).

What precisely is your qualification in this field?

[Kezzer]

What precisely is your qualification in this field?

A GCSE

[LWA]

First off, stop being so proud of yourself.

A GCSE

How about you take it easy on the guy? phoenixmystic has taken the time to write quite his feelings on an important issue only to have you rip into him at the earliest opportunity.

This place is designed to let everyone have their own opinion.

My apologies for going off topic, I just thought that was out of order.

[YorkieBen]

the global warming argument is a theory, it isn't fact. I worry that the Govt are jumpoing on a bandwagon to get votes and in doing so will damage our economy when our contribution compared to China and the US is tiny

[Kezzer]

How about you take it easy on the guy? phoenixmystic has taken the time to write quite his feelings on an important issue only to have you rip into him at the earliest opportunity.

This place is designed to let everyone have their own opinion.

My apologies for going off topic, I just thought that was out of order.

It was justified. You can't come in and say "I have this opinion, and you know what, I'm educated therefore I'm right." That's pretty much what he said. He wasn't making an opinion, it was a statement because he concluded he was correct.

EDIT: And what's the point in dwelling on the negative and not giving any input? You're only feeding the negativity. If you have a problem with me, then pm me in the future and I'll gladly apologise for any unjustified act I've made.

[LWA]

It was justified. You can't come in and say "I have this opinion, and you know what, I'm educated therefore I'm right." That's pretty much what he said. He wasn't making an opinion, it was a statement because he concluded he was correct.

Seriously, please take another look. His thoughts finished with 'my 2 pence worth' i.e. opening his thoughts up to everyone else to comment.

I simply fail to see why you couldn't make a constructive post like kalniel instead you had to belittle him?

And no I wont be PM'ing you, I'll leave this now. If you feel you weren't unduly harsh to the OP, well that's your call.

Again, my apologies for taking this off topic. If a mod feels so inclined, please feel free to delete my posts.

[TiG]

Well anyone who saw the Channel 4 documentary on this whole subject would seriously argue a lot of the points. The great global warming swindle argues so many of the key fundemental discussions to global warming, and formed such a well rounded argument I am seriously at a loss to see what the fuss is about.

Especially when we look at the % of CO2 that is generated by humans compared to the planet as a whole.

I don't see how such a small % change can make any difference.

TiG

[Kezzer]

I simply fail to see why you couldn't make a constructive post like kalniel instead you had to belittle him?

I did make a constructive post. The post directly after his first one is 90% made up of the subject matter, so, unlike yourself, I did actually reply to this thread.

And no I wont be PM'ing you, I'll leave this now. If you feel you weren't unduly harsh to the OP, well that's your call.

And no, you won't be PM'ing me because you want to get the higher ground thus want to show everyone that you're reacting to what I've said. Whereas I'm replying publicly to this to prove that I did make a constructive post in the first place, yet you sit here and blatantly oppose the facts.

[Andeh13]

the global warming argument is a theory, it isn't fact. I worry that the Govt are jumpoing on a bandwagon to get votes and in doing so will damage our economy when our contribution compared to China and the US is tiny

I couldnt agree more, with the likes of china & india pushing through into the 21st century, do you really think we can do anything?

I try to do my bit, wear an extra layer instead of turning up the heat, turning off the tap & lights at every possible moment etc, but when i watch motorists (EU cars etc produce 1.5% of the worlds CO2, US double - was on a TV program not so long, ago i think) & flyers take such a hammering it does anoy me.

[LWA]

I did make a constructive post. The post directly after his first one is 90% made up of the subject matter, so, unlike yourself, I did actually reply to this thread.

My apologies Kezzer, I did not mean to upset you. I was simply stating that I don't agree with using personal/derogatory comments to undermine someone in a discussion.

[[GSV]Trig]

Yes we should recycle more.
Yes people should get off there arses a bit more and be less lazy.
Global warming isn't our fault, the earth will do exactly what its doing and will carry on doing it for as long as the Sun burns, yes we are having an effect but its such a small effect its not worth worrying about.
We shouldnt stand for the Government taxing everything, this once proud nation has turned into a load of moaning old women that'll moan all day and do sod all, then bugger off to spain or somewhere else to live.

[Byatt]

Well anyone who saw the Channel 4 documentary on this whole subject would seriously argue a lot of the points. The great global warming swindle argues so many of the key fundemental discussions to global warming, and formed such a well rounded argument I am seriously at a loss to see what the fuss is about.

http://www.realclimate.org/index.php...dled/#more-414

If there's any questions from the documentary you don't think that answers, let me know via PM and I'll do my best.

Global warming isn't our fault, the earth will do exactly what its doing and will carry on doing it for as long as the Sun burns, yes we are having an effect but its such a small effect its not worth worrying about

Latest research gives you a 1/10 chance or worse of being right. Latest broadsheet articles give you no chance of being right (distortion one way) and TV shows like the C4 one on Sunday want you to believe the whole thing is some massive conspiracy because, frankly, that's more entertaining (distortion the other). All those statements come with an 'in my opinion' clause.

I have done this to death in other threads, but go and chase up the full scientific reports first hand (from the IPCC, or wherever) if you're interested in this because the information that finds it's way into the public domain is, frankly, a damning indictment on the state of the press to communicate science.