The Netherlands proposes to ban the burka (full veil)

[Ben_]

well you trust who you like mate, i'd place my trust in the government if i were you seen as they are the guardians of your civil liberties. if you want to place your faith in the burkha wearers then you should consider the kinds of savage backwards societies most of them come from

[superscaper]

I'd prefer a "make religion history" band. Why target islam specifically? And society by it's nature doesn't belong to anyone, it's simply a state of being made up of it's component people, it isn't a club people join.

[superscaper]

if you want to place your faith in the burkha wearers then you should consider the kinds of savage backwards societies most of them come from

I thought true786 IS a muslim. I'm an atheist stoutly against any form of religion and even I found that comment offensive and ignorant.

[father smurf]

(ignore)

[superscaper]

i think this topic shud be deletd before hexus staff get sued!

What would they be sued for?

[true786]

why would anyone get sued? Everyone is entitled to their own opinion what ever it maybe, yes I am a muslim and british and extremely proud.

Ben, you put your faith in the goverment who provide you with civil liberties and at the same time that goverment which you entrust is allied with those 'backward savage countries'. Religion and the goverment are too different things, I didnt support the War in Iraq, does that mean that i should attack christianity seen as tho the UK is considered a christian country? Of course not, I am not that niave.

My alliance is not with the govermen its with my fellow brits.

[superscaper]

My alliance is not with the govermen its with my fellow brits.

Exactly, being patriotic has absolutely nothing to do with supporting the government. Absolute trust in the government breeds complacency. We should be keeping the government on their toes and making them prove themselves time and again. They are meant to reflect and represent the people and so by that definition they should not simply be left to their own devices to develop in their own way as a separate entity.

[chrestomanci]

I agree too. I'm not too sure of the facts here but I think I heard in Isreal and Iraq etc female suicide bombers have used this as a sort of disguise to hide explosives?

Now I know not every muslim is a suicide bomber, but even if 1 out of the 100 was, and it stopped that 1, I think it would be worth it in my personal opinion.

I don't think it is suicide bombers we have to worry about.

What is to stop a bunch of ordinary criminals dressing up in veils or burkas and then going on a bank robbing spree safe from security cameras? They need not be Muslim or even Asian, though they would probably have to be women to look convincing.

In the current climate there would be little banks could do about it because if they asked all costomers to remove their veils they would be accused of discrimination. What we need is a law to say that anyone who refuses service (access to property or employment) to anyone who hides their face is not guilty of religious discrimination so long as their rules apply to all ways that someone might hide their face (crash helments etc) and not just veils.

[superscaper]

In the current climate there would be little banks could do about it because if they asked all costomers to remove their veils they would be accused of discrimination. What we need is a law to say that anyone who refuses service (access to property or employment) to anyone who hides their face is not guilty of religious discrimination so long as their rules apply to all ways that someone might hide their face (crash helments etc) and not just veils.

My view on that kind of thing is that there shouldn't be government involvement at all. Let the banks (which are private companies) make their own rules and be as descriminating as they like. If you don't like a bank's rules
then take your custom elsewhere. Market forces and capitalism IMHO are self regulating with appropriate built in system feedback and don't require nannying by the government, in fact government involvement is what ruins that feedback and prevents the free market achieving its' natural state.

[MadduckUK]

i think this topic shud be deletd before hexus staff get sued!

Everybody Panic!

[superscaper]

Everybody Panic!

I'm a bit busy now but I'll save it up and panic later on tonight.

[Ben_]

My view on that kind of thing is that there shouldn't be government involvement at all. Let the banks (which are private companies) make their own rules and be as descriminating as they like. If you don't like a bank's rules
then take your custom elsewhere. Market forces and capitalism IMHO are self regulating with appropriate built in system feedback and don't require nannying by the government, in fact government involvement is what ruins that feedback and prevents the free market achieving its' natural state.

you might want to think a little more carefully about what your actually saying there

[superscaper]

you might want to think a little more carefully about what your actually saying there

I know exactly what I'm saying, I'm a libertarian, so my views are obviously going to be libertarian.

[Ben_]

to think that a system with no state control whatsoever would be self-regulating is extremely naive. the banks could implement systems to benefit any group it was in their interest to benefit, whilst forgetting the others. this would make the minority or undesirable groups disenfranchised and the balance of opportunity would be worse than it is already. there needs to be state control to ensure that equality is monitored even on the most basic level.

i suggest you read about the development of capitalism to see how it has evolved to where it is now, rather than reading the introductory chapter to an economics book and assuming the theoretical ideal actually works in reality.

[superscaper]

dont try and hide your ignorance behind a political stance that would distance themselves as far as possible from your ridiculous ideas

Would you like to point out precisely what's wrong with my views (which I'm allowed to have) without trying to insult me. Also would you like to explain what you think libertarianism is then if I'm so wrong?

[Ben_]

ok i edited my post and removed the insult and replaced it with explanation