MSI P7N SLI & Thermalright Ultra-12 help pls !

[zander110689]

OK guys so im upgrading my comp from an amd 5600+ to a q6600 and hoping to do a wee bit of OC. Hopfully up to around the 3.4-3.6 mark, judging on the overclocking potential of this board. In one review i saw then get up to 3.8/9 on a Q6600 :O. On air aswell. But anyways, this will be my setup.

CPU: Q6600 ( cooler Thermalright Ultra-12+Akasa AK174CB-4BLB 120mm Blue LED Fan)
Mobo: MSI P7N SLI (nforce 750i)
Ram: 4X1GB OCZ 8500+ sli ready ram ( 1066mhz, 5-5-5-15)
PSU: 850W Zalman ZM850-HP
GXF card: 2 X 8800gtx SLI]

Now i have just 2 questions. One will that beast of a cooler ( with a 120mm fan attached ) fit with my mobo as it has quite big heatsyncs next to the processor. ( if anyone could take a look on google, cos i cant post and links or URL's till ive posted 5 posts )



Lastly will my PSU handle this ( i looked on the nvidia site and it is SLi compliant with 2 9800 gx2's and 2 8800 gtx's) but will it also handle the extra power needed by OCing the processor? ( im slightly new to OCing ( got my amd 5600 to 3.08 each core stable with load temps around 40-45) but i dunno how much the PSU would influence on it. If anyone experienced OCer's and people who have this cooler could gime some advice it would be wikid.

Thanks all

[chuckskull]

I haven't used the MSI board but I've used, the 650i and the 590 and it was enough to put me off nforce boards for a long while, despite swearing by them for years.

I'd recommend scrapping Sli(assuming you don't already own the cards) and waiting for the new series from nvidia and Ati, which are due in a matter of weeks. Getting a single big card and an intel chipset. Which will overclock just as well and usually run a lot cooler.

Running anywhere near 3.8ghz even on the Q6600 is a long shot and requires you drop lucky on your purchase. 3.4-3.6 is a realistic goal though. That PSU will run that setup with the overclock without any problems. Though my personal preference would be leaning toward Seasonic or Enermax.

[zander110689]

wow, fast reply mate thanks. well i aint gona be purchasing this stuff for at least 2-3 weeks. ( ive gota exams coming up and dont wana distract myself) oooo so nvidia are bringing out a new line of cards anyway?? wt the 9900?i mean the problem is i already have one 8800 gtx at the moment and considering they are selling for around £130-60 on ebay i thought it would be worth my while getting a second on the cheap and upgrading to a big card ie the 9900's when they come out, and when i have £300 to burn which i no will give me a significant increase over 2 8800 gtx's sli ( ie the proper new line from nvidia, since the 9800's are just filler cards, with the 9800 gtx being almost exactly the same as the 8800 gtx and the 9800 gx2 jus being 2 8800gt's downclocked and stuck ontop of eachother.) also the problem arises that with the new line of cards my PSu may not be suffient to run two in SLi ( i always wana stay one step ahead, having a PSu that is able to run 2 gfx cards in the line above my current one)

and in reply to the nforce boards, ive never used a intel one, and its just this MSI board is mena be one of the best around for £100 plus its overclocking is up there with the best of em, + parently it is a very stable OCer. ( i would post u the link to the review but again i cnt yet unless i just spam other 3 posts after this to be able to . lol)

edit: being cool im not too bothered, my case keeps everthing pretty chilly. well see what happens when the summer brings the heat though ( hopfeully, lol)

[chuckskull]

The general consensus is that if you can afford the top end cards it's better to sell the old and get the newer top end one. Your options are basically Another 8800GTX for £130-160 or the same amount off the newer cards. Personally I'd take the latter. Sli is great on paper but doesn't always scale well on some games or even work at all until the game is patched for it.

There isn't much bar a few pics and some specs which may or may not be correct for the new nvidia card at the moment. The GTX 280 as it's currently known. Either way I'd take a long hard look at the new cards reviews(once they're out of course) before plumping for the second GTX. No doubt 2 8800GTX's will be powerful, but you may be able to get even more performance for less heat, power consumption for a very similar outlay.

As for the motherboard, generally speaking your chip will run out of legs before the motherboard does, on both the high end intel and nvidia chipsets. In the hundred quid range the Abit IP-35 Pro is a great clocker on the Intel side.

Don't take this as me completely panning your build, but you already know pretty much everything about it and I'm sure it would work just fine. I'm just offering you alternatives in the same price range. Both setups have advantages and disadvantages.

[Noxvayl]

General consensus around here is to steer clear of nForce boards because they are unstable when overclocking and very temperamental. The Intel boards such as the P35/X38/X48 are much better overclockers, they reach over 500Mhz on most occasions(which translates to 2Ghz rated FSB).

Personally I'd get either the GA-P35-DQ6 or the MSI P35 NEO2-FR. They are both excellent boards which overclock extremely well. IMO these board are far better then the nForce boards.

Here is a review containing the exact Gigabyte board linked with the bigger brother to the MSI board linked(only real difference is DDR3 tbh, nothing else significant extra)> AnandTech: Intel P35: Intel's Mainstream Chipset Grows Up

And here are individual reviews> GA-P35-DQ6 MSI NEO2-FR

I'd replace the nForce motherboard you have listed above with either of the 2 I have mentioned and then wait for the new series of GFX cards to come out. By August we should see the entire range surface including the X2 and GX2 variants. Then you can make your choice of which single card is best.

Your PSU is a bit much for what you need tbh. One of these would do just fine for SLI or Crossfire; Seasonic M12-600W or Enermax Liberty modular Series.

Hope this helps

[zander110689]

thanks guys, i mean i dont tink the PSU's uve listed would happliy run 2 8800 gtx's i mean i have a 600w and apart from not having 4 6pin molex connectors, parently its recomended u get a much high Watt PSU, plus i think this one i have is on its last legs, so may just replace it with a quality one like the one i listed. Hmmmmm so the general consensus would be that Intel based chipsets are much better for OC and more stable? dw chuckskull im not taking it ur trying to tell me how to build but im on here to get advice off those more experienced than me, member this computer was my first build and this is the first upgrade ive done since i replaced my ram and GFX card. so an intel board seems the way to go. Gota member that i will be using this for gaming alot, ripping, encoding etc. so how do intel chipsets compare to nforce ones in the sepctrum of gaming? is there any perfromance decrease or is it better etc? i mean i am going to hold off on the extra gfx card for a while as i dont have the money to fork out, i was getting the bigger PSU etc in preperation for a 2nd one but i will happily wait till the new batch comes out and check it then. but atm now it seems to be the mobo which i am considering i mean the MSi P7N is a wikid mobo and is tri SLi, but i doubt i will ever get the money, or technology will move slow enough, for me to upgrade to 3 way sli, seem impractible. so as many suggestions on intel based mobos that are good for OCing and gaming would be wikid

edit: one mroe thing im only going for sli not crossfire, i used to be amd fanboy, but tbh they have fallen so far behind when it comes to GFX cards im sticking with nvidia for now

[chuckskull]

Well like I said I ran the 650i chipset until recently, it died. On the Intel chipset side; I went for the Abit IP-35 Pro. Which turned me into an Abit fanboi overnight. It pushed my chip as high as it could on this cooling(366x9, I also tried 415x8, the board didn't even break a sweat). Most of this done in windows thanks to Abit's excellent uGuru.

It also has an LED POST do-dad(If it cant boot it gives you a code, you, look in the manual and you've found your problem), which after using one for the first time, should be on EVERY motherboard in my opinion. Far better than trying to decipher those annoying beeps or on a lot of boards just staring at the case scratching your head.

All the info you could ever want right here, warts and all http://forums.hexus.net/abit-care-he...de-thread.html

Scan were selling these for £80 not long ago, I paid more for mine and still thought it was an excellent bargain.

Some reviews;

AnandTech: abit IP35-Pro: Houston, We Have a Winner
Universal abit IP35 PRO Review - XtremeSystems Forums (dont have time to re-read the whole thread but if I'm right the reviewer got his x6800 to the 3.8 range that impressed you so much on the MSI)

[Noxvayl]

thanks guys, i mean i dont tink the PSU's uve listed would happliy run 2 8800 gtx's i mean i have a 600w and apart from not having 4 6pin molex connectors, parently its recomended u get a much high Watt PSU, plus i think this one i have is on its last legs, so may just replace it with a quality one like the one i listed. Hmmmmm so the general consensus would be that Intel based chipsets are much better for OC and more stable? dw chuckskull im not taking it ur trying to tell me how to build but im on here to get advice off those more experienced than me, member this computer was my first build and this is the first upgrade ive done since i replaced my ram and GFX card. so an intel board seems the way to go. Gota member that i will be using this for gaming alot, ripping, encoding etc. so how do intel chipsets compare to nforce ones in the sepctrum of gaming? is there any perfromance decrease or is it better etc? i mean i am going to hold off on the extra gfx card for a while as i dont have the money to fork out, i was getting the bigger PSU etc in preperation for a 2nd one but i will happily wait till the new batch comes out and check it then. but atm now it seems to be the mobo which i am considering i mean the MSi P7N is a wikid mobo and is tri SLi, but i doubt i will ever get the money, or technology will move slow enough, for me to upgrade to 3 way sli, seem impractible. so as many suggestions on intel based mobos that are good for OCing and gaming would be wikid

edit: one mroe thing im only going for sli not crossfire, i used to be amd fanboy, but tbh they have fallen so far behind when it comes to GFX cards im sticking with nvidia for now

Those PSU's would be fine m8, seriously. You don't need much more than 600W for SLI even if you have the best cards. Check this PSU calculator> eXtreme Power Supply Calculator Lite v2.5

These are the specs I entered: Single socket(dual/quad socket is for servers or Intel skulltrail, its the amount of sockets not CPU's so 2 Q6600 would constitute 2 sockets), High end desktop, Q6600 G0 stepping CPU, 100% utilisation(to replicate running orthos or prime95), overclock info was 3600Mhz with 1.4v, 4 sticks of DDR2 RAM, 8800GTX, SLI for the video type, 3 SATA HDD's, 2 DVD RW drives, 5 120mm fans, 3 usb devices and the rest of the options left as is. Those specs only require 591W which means a 600W PSU would sufficiently and safely supply an overclocked SLI setup similar to yours. Remember the calculator shows the rated watts that the power supplies are sold at so a 590W rated PSU would work with the above system.

People often over estimate power requirements for computers because not long ago power requirements were increasing with every new product. Now with every new product power requirements are being reduced so the need for bigger PSU's is not necessary. The Core 2 duo CPU's use half the power that Pentium 4 D required and with GFX cards its the same(maybe not half the requirement but certainly less power than previous generations).

There is no need to waste money with more power when it will never be used, and I say never because requirements are always being reduced.

As for your current PSU it would be helpful to replace it because the newer PSU's supply much more current than previous PSU's which is what is needed for SLI. Note that the PSU's recommended are SLI certified.

[zander110689]

cool cool, well its really between two boards then Abit IP-35 Pro and the MSI P35 NEO2-FR, Also ive just seen that there is a q6600 B3 and a q6600 GO what is the difference between the two, cos on some sights it doesnt even state what it is :S and i did that test thing and it was recommended that i get a 968w PSU :O

edit: i was looking on overclockers .co.uk and they say the q6600 has SCLAR stepping, not GO or B3? which one is it :S this is really confusing. lol

[chuckskull]

Short answer G0/SLACR is the newer/now standard chip.

Long answer AnandTech: Intel Core 2 Q6600 G0 Stepping: Cheap Quad Core Just Got Better

[Noxvayl]

and i did that test thing and it was recommended that i get a 968w PSU :O

You must of put quad sockets then. A quad core CPU means that there are 4 CPU's on one die and only one chip gets inserted into the motherboard. Quad sockets means that 4 chips(ie 4x Q6600 CPU's) get inserted into the motherboard, it does not mean quad core. That is the only way you could of got it wrong unless you put 10HDD's and capacitor ageing at 50% which is highly improbable because your PSU needs to be 4 years or older to reach that sort of ageing. Generally good quality PSU's age at 10% per year. Its not possible for your system as you have stated above to draw that much power.

[zander110689]

ok guys, just as a heads up, the boards u recommended were either crossfire, ( the two Exhail recommened) or the abit pro isnt sli certified, it has one 16x slot and another with 16X but only 4X bandwith. and on the scan sight this says it isnt SLi certified. Are there any decent intel chipsets out there that are SLI compliant for under £100 which offer the same OC performance as the ones mentioned. I will probably wait for the new range of cards to come out from nvidia but i would like to be able upgrade to SLI if need be. any suggestions would be wikid ( btw thanks for all ur help so far )

edit: Ive had a quick scan about and there seem to be no SLI p35 boards! and all intel boards above that only seem to be crossfire? if this is the case i may have to switch back to the MSI nforce mobo, which judging by the nforce bad rep i reli dont wana switch back.

[not_my_ip]

Teh intel new chipsets (ip31,35) supports only xfire for some reason. So if u want to have SLI I guess it is back to nforce

[zander110689]

wow that sucks, considering ati gfx cards suk ass grrrrr

[chuckskull]

Unless you have a 30inch monitor you didn't mention, one graphics card is more than enough. Especially if you're going for the highest end new card.

[Noxvayl]

nVidia have kept all there technology in house which means no-one beside them can manufacture SLI motherboards so if you want SLI(which isn't very useful anyway) you need to get the nForce boards which most of us dislike. Honestly SLI is pointless because it is supported by few games and even in the games supported it gives you only a 20% boost which is less than purchasing a newer gen card.

As for ATI cards being bad that is a misconception. Just because they are slower than the nVidia cards doesn't mean they are crap. For a cheaper card the ATI cards are actually better because drivers are less likely to cause major problems stopping you from playing games or even working on your PC for very long. I moved from ATI to nVidia and although the card is faster if I could change that decision I would because ATI drivers from my experience have been far better and less problematic.

If you sold your 8800GTX and bought the HD3870 X2 you would notice a significant difference in performance. The difference in price compared to the difference in performance is second to none, so imo ATI cards can be the better choice but people don't seem to be able to look past 2-8 difference in FPS on a certain game.