Overclockers.co.uk return policy - Entitled to a full refund?

[malice19]

Been advised by O.C. that the card has been sent back to the supplier and will take up to 28 days from sending to be replaced/repaired.

So now looks like i have to wait 3 more weeks for a replacement as i sent it back to OC 2 weeks ago. You would think they would send one out of there own stock like the one i purchased from them?

[dangel]

....

[Saracen]

Been advised by O.C. that the card has been sent back to the supplier and will take up to 28 days from sending to be replaced/repaired.

So now looks like i have to wait 3 more weeks for a replacement as i sent it back to OC 2 weeks ago. You would think they would send one out of there own stock like the one i purchased from them?

Well, no, I wouldn't expect that. Or not necessarily, anyway.

There's a strong hint of the reasoning in the quote from OcUK you gave in your first post ...

1. Direct Manufacturer Technical Support. Some manufacturers are happy to provide direct technical support and returns processing within 28 days of purchase. This is often the best solution for the customer with the highest standards of technical support, latest information and fastest returns processing. Please see the table below marked "Under 28 Day Support". Any support offered by manufacturers does not affect your statutory rights.

So you've got to consider three possible scenarios :-

1) Your Sale of Goods Act rights
2) Any additional warranty offered by OcUK
3) Any additional warranty offered by the manufacturer.

If, as appears to be the case, this is a manufacturer warranty replacement, then if OcUK just decide to replace from their stock and then the manufacturer turn round and decline the claim for some reason, OcUK are stuffed and end up eating the cost. It would be entirely unreasonable to expect any retailer to accept that risk just to speed up the process.

Of course, some retailers have arrangements with some manufacturers that first-line decision-making gets done by the retailer, but that'll almost certainly be dependent on a contract between then stating what they can and can't do.

So .... if the replacement option is at the discretion of the manufacturer, they are usually going to be the ones making the decision, not the retailer. For a manufacturer warranty, you could send the card back to them direct, and all OcUK are really doing is acting as a kind of clearing house, to do it for you.

So that's the thirds option. The second is if OcUK offer a direct replacement warranty themselves. I've no idea if they do or not, and if they do, what the terms are. It's been a very long time since I've looked at their T&Cs. But generally, where a retailer does that, they also reserve the right to verify that the board is faulty before doing it, or it'd be open to huge abuse. Some tests might be simple and done in-house, such as by plugging a board into their own test rigs and if it works, the board isn't actually faulty. They may then make a decision quickly. But, especially with complex computing parts, it may not always be obvious if the product was supplied faulty, or more likely to have been damaged by misuse or abuse, and in that case, depending on what their warranty actually says, they may want to get an "expert" opinion and that expert may well be the manufacturer.

Remember, retailers aren't required to offer their own explicit warranties, but if they do, subject to basic terms about them being clear and in clear English, etc, they will be subject to whatever T&Cs they apply. That's the second option.

And the first option is the consumer legislation route, under which you have basic rights the retailer must comply with, but those rights have limitations in relation to "faulty" goods, again which give the retailer some room for manoeuvre, precisely because of the "misuse or abuse" possibility.

The SoGA says, basically, that the retailer is responsible, for up to 6 years (England and Wales) for faults that existed at time of sale, though for the first 6 months, the legal presumption is that that fault did exist, unless the retailer can prove otherwise. So we're back to the possibility of misuse or abuse, or even perhaps overt deliberate damage, and "proving" that it isn't their liability might well require an "expert" opinion, so again, we're probably back to a manufacturer opinion.

All that is the basic situation. There is more to it than that, such as rules over how long a replacement/refund can take, but that revolves around words like "undue inconvenience". When does a delay in replacing cause "undue inconvenience"? Is it "undue" for a supplier to take reasonable steps over a graphics card, and if we were talking about, say, a wedding dress for a wedding on Saturday, would "28 days" be unreasonable?

Well, a delay is "undue inconvenience", essentially, when you take it before a court and that court rules that it is. Exactly when that will happen is likely to vary from case to case, depending on the nature of the product, the nature of the situation. For instance, if that wedding dress was ordered 6 months ago for wedding in June, and the couple have brought the wedding forward 4 months without telling the dress supplier, and meantime, the bride has lost 4 stone and needs the dress altered, then telling them on Wednesday that the alternations must be done in two or three days may well not be reasonable. On the other hand, if the dress was ordered and delivered on the expected date, only to find it's torn, then that's be different, and would likely be inconvenient as hell.

So .... consumer legislation is written in a way that deliberately allows the court to exercise a LOT of discretion according to circumstance, and that word "undue" is very slippery. In my wedding dress example where the date was changed and the bride lost weight, I'm sure not having a dress that fits would be seen by the bride as extremely inconvenient, but is it "undue"? I suspect a court would see it as entirely due, because the date was brought forward and the maker not told about the weight loss.

So OcUK sending the board back might be a right pain in the butt to you, but looking at it from their perspective, is it either surprising or unreasonable? Probably not, especially if all they are doing is acting a middleman to fulfil the manufacturer warranty .

It's not, in my opinion, all that clear-cut.

[Saracen]

Having personally spoken the their MD during my attempt at an RMA a few years back I'm not surprised at all. Not one bit in fact.

I'm surprised he hasn't asked for your first born and a pint of your blood first too.

Let's not go there, please. Let's keep this on topic for malice's thread, or it'll descend into another anti-OcUK rant. If it does, I'll start deleting posts.

[Antagram]

A bit late now, but when you requested a RMA did you specifically state you wanted a refund? As when I went through this proceedure once I missed that essential word out of the message, and ended up getting a replacement.

Still a bit poor you've got to wait on manufacturer repair when they have four HIS 6950's in stock.

[malice19]

A bit late now, but when you requested a RMA did you specifically state you wanted a refund? As when I went through this proceedure once I missed that essential word out of the message, and ended up getting a replacement.

Still a bit poor you've got to wait on manufacturer repair when they have four HIS 6950's in stock.

Yes i did as for a full refund

"I no longer wish to waste any more time with this product as I have no confidence in its reliability and is not fit for purpose, so request that you provide a full refund or exchange with a new same performance equivalent or better alternative graphics card.

Please contact me within 14 days to arrange return of the goods.

Thank you for your time.

Yours sincerely"


Answer
I am afraid that the item is outside of the 7 days under the Distance selling regulations to return an item back to us as unwated. We can only allow incoming returns within the first 7 days of receipt. After this time period we can only actually allow a return if the item is faulty. As this order is over 7 days old i can not authorise for a return as unwanted.

Regards,

James Bailey

I have not know a site not send out a replacement from their own stock, and yes could see that they are still selling my card with stock

Knew i should have not strayed away from Scan just because it was a bit cheaper : ( Never again!

[Antagram]

I personally wouldn't have provided the further two options after requesting a full refund. So my preferred outcome wasn't diminished by the other options, or risked misinterpretation by OcUK.

Unfortunately for you OcUK seem to have partially gone with your second option, but are waiting on a manufacturer replacement instead of sending an in stock item. Pretty poor, so can only hope HIS are speedy.

After reading threads on OcUK forum I was considering my next graphics card from there. As they have done some good exchanges compared to other retailers who give partial refunds based on cards age. So interesting to read about the bad publicity returns too.

[CaptainCrash]

After reading threads on OcUK forum I was considering my next graphics card from there. As they have done some good exchanges compared to other retailers who give partial refunds based on cards age. So interesting to read about the bad publicity returns too.

Again without wanting to get into the whole OcUK thing, you're unlikely to read anything negative about the company on their own forums, as it will likely be deleted by the mods/dons, and the poster will probably be warned or even banned.

It's no secret that the OcUK forum's main purpose is to act as a vehicle to drive business to the shop (it explicitly states as much in the Esnet company accounts) - personally I don't have too much of a problem with it, as at least they're upfront about having an agenda, and everyone knows where they stand and can evaluate what they see accordingly. It's still a useful technical resource, and there are some smart and knowledgeable people there, even though some of the restrictions as to what you can or can't mention seem a bit puerile at times.

[McPhee]

Yes i did as for a full refund

"I no longer wish to waste any more time with this product as I have no confidence in its reliability and is not fit for purpose, so request that you provide a full refund or exchange with a new same performance equivalent or better alternative graphics card.

Please contact me within 14 days to arrange return of the goods.

Thank you for your time.

Yours sincerely"


Answer
I am afraid that the item is outside of the 7 days under the Distance selling regulations to return an item back to us as unwated. We can only allow incoming returns within the first 7 days of receipt. After this time period we can only actually allow a return if the item is faulty. As this order is over 7 days old i can not authorise for a return as unwanted.

Regards,

James Bailey

Your mistake with that letter is that you gave them room for interpretation. You need to be specific in future and not give the retailer any wriggling room. Something down the lines of:

I've been having trouble with my HIS 6950 since the day it arrived and it is now clear to me that there is nothing I can do to get the card working. As such I would like to return the card as faulty for a full refund.

Please contact me within 14 days to arrange return of the goods.

Thank you for your time.

Yours sincerely

With your letter they chose to interperate that you wanted to return the card as it's no longer wanted rather than you wanting to return the card because it's faulty. You also gave them the option to replace the card, which they will naturally take because returning to the manufacturer for a replacement is of no financial detriment to them (unlike offering you a refund).

[gavbon]

i used to be an avid overclockers customer back in the day

their customer service has seriously suffered over the past few years


happy taking money and no prepare to refund their faulty rubbish!!!

[malice19]

Received my new replacement 6950 last week and have not had any problems at all.
Had to send a chase on the 28th day asking for an update but they then got back to me within 3 hours advising they had sent me a replacement and it was with me the next day.

Happy days!
Thanks for all your help and time all.

[mike306dt]

Hi,

Just thought I'd add my own story about this 'business'

I purchased a motherboard back in the p55 days from ocuk - it turned up damaged which I believe I posted about here at the time.

I sent it back, they said I'd damaged it, Warranty void, charged me for 'testing' with their eyes obviously and billed my card without authorisation for return postage.

Good luck is all I'll say to you - You're gonna need it.

[watercooled]

I wouldn't let it settle at that, not if you didn't damage it anyway!