Theater 650 Pro Discussion

[spacded]

Quote What will be done with the recalled Theater 650 cards? Will they be remanufactured (refurbished) and put back on store selves or will they be destroyed (or other).

Nah they will be sold as new to us mugs in UK/Europe no doubt.

not that im cynical, my current 550 pro looks great on my new plasma via MCE , if the new one is even better bring the bladdy thing out in the uk mate

[archcommus]

Is the Catalyst Media Center going to be made available on ATI's website anytime soon?

[dabl]

...The reason I ask about being able to distinguish effected cards by “serial number” is because many buyers would like to know with a glance whether or not they have an effected/defective card,…even before installation (even after the recall). In many cases, if a product is recalled in mass or selectively the manufacturer will issues some means to determine which of the products are effected, for example s/n xxxx.xxxx.1xxx through xxxx.xxxx.9xxx....

FYI,

--Don

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http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=8406411&&#post8406411

ati seems to have re-added the 650 back to their product page, and is being advertised on the main page.

The thing is that the item that is listed now, has got a different product.

before recall, it was product # 100-703261.

a few days later when it re-apeared it now has product # 100-715331

[Octavean]

Thanks for posting that info dabl,…

I get the feeling that the older SKU # 100-703261 will resurface somewhere perhaps as refurbished batches and possibly on the likes of flea-bay.

In any case, there seems to be a great potential for confusion between the older product and the newer one. It would be helpful to some to be mindful of the differences should they whish to discriminate between the two.

[Bill T]

Here's some Answers to your questions. Hope this helps.

Q. fanbanlo "Suggestions on what kind of antenna to look for?"
A - While doing testing, I have used many different antennas, and there is a difference noticed when you use a more powerfull powered antenna. But it will greatly depend on your location. If you are far away, you may still need a powered antenna, but if you are close to the source of the signal, then a simple possive antenna will work just fine.

Q. fanbanlo "Would CMC be available soon for 550? When? How to obtain a copy? net download or order CD? price?"
A - Currently it is only available with the TV Wonder 650, and the TV Wonder 200.

Q. fanbanlo "Where has MM headed to?"
A - He isn't at ATI anymore, I'm not sure where he's workin now. I only met him once, so I don't know too much about him.

Q. Seraphic- "I still have my TV Wonder 650 and I want to know why it isn't able to also do 640x480? The card does 720x480
fine, but is 640x480 locked/turned off? If yes, when will it be unlocked?"
A - I'm not sure what you are talking about. What software are you using?

Q. Octavean "And finally, how does the Theater 650 function in MCE 2K5 and similar PVR applications given its NTSC/ATSC
concurrent limitation? Does MCE generate appropriate notifications informing the user of a tuner conflict during
a request for concurrent operation or does it simply allow it resulting in corrupted or missed recordings."

A -I tried it, and when you are recording with one, and try to watch the other, it says that the channel is not available and recomends that you restart MCE. If you try to record two channels at once(one Analog, one Digital) neither get recorded. There is an error that pops up right when they start to record. FYI, when you use CMC, it makes you choose before hand in case you accidentally schedual to record both at once so that you don't end up with nothing.

[Octavean]

Q. Octavean "And finally, how does the Theater 650 function in MCE 2K5 and similar PVR applications given its NTSC/ATSC
concurrent limitation? Does MCE generate appropriate notifications informing the user of a tuner conflict during
a request for concurrent operation or does it simply allow it resulting in corrupted or missed recordings."

A -I tried it, and when you are recording with one, and try to watch the other, it says that the channel is not available and recomends that you restart MCE. If you try to record two channels at once(one Analog, one Digital) neither get recorded. There is an error that pops up right when they start to record. FYI, when you use CMC, it makes you choose before hand in case you accidentally schedual to record both at once so that you don't end up with nothing.

Well, thank you very much for your candor and the information.

This corroborates one account that I have come across with respect to the Theater 650 Pro NTSC /ATSC issue in MCE 2K5. However, that account also detailed a subsequent crash after the error message but since there were other tuners installed in the system it wasn’t clearly associated with the Theater 650.

Its difficult to interpret these accounts because the illustrated message is uncommon enough for me to never have seen them.

Bluntly, it seems more like a genuine error message and it really looks like ATI got something wrong IMO.

The following is a common notification resulting from a single tuner scheduling conflict.

STOP RECORDING

Media Center is currently Recording “ insert show here “ do you want to stop recording it?

This informs the user of the limitations of the configuration with respect to the action requested. Note that no reboot is required and there is no need to restart MCE.

The following is a common notification resulting from a dual tuner scheduling conflict

Viewing or list conflict

All tuners are in use. Would you like to view tuner status and select a tuner to use?

Selecting “yes” displays the available tuners (and what is being recorded on them) with an option to reallocate one of the tuners currently in use. Selecting “no” results in no channel change, recording change or viewing change.

However, the suggestion to “restart MCE” as you cited just doesn’t sound right at all.

Is this a consistent result (repeatable)?

Is the error message within the MCE GUI or is the user bounced out of the interface and presented with a GPF or BSOD type dialogue?

Is it a recoverable issue?

Is this with a recalled version of the Theater 650 or with the new “Improved” version?

It’s rather unfortunate but this simply doesn’t sound like normal operation within MCE. Something just isnt right here!

[dabl]

Bill T, would it be possible for you to please confirm the 650 will work (both tuners recognized etc.) with Media Center in Vista RC1?

--Don

[dabl]

Re: PCI express version of this card I called Powercolor and spoke to a sales guy.

For what it's worth when I asked about their PCI-e version of the card the guy mentioned the recent ATI production issues, and confirmed they were waiting for that to get straightened out before proceeding with their own card.

When I asked him if perhaps their card might be out in the next month or so (I'm so optimistic) he said it was likely to be longer away than that.

Damn.

The waiting is the hardest part.

[Bill T]

First off,
dabl,
Yes both tuners are recognized in Vista RC1 Media Center.


Hey Octavean,

After reading your response I thought I'd go into more detail on this for you.

First off, this is the new "Improved" version of the 650.

The error message is in the MCE GUI.

Ok, I figured out that the error I was recieving was because there was no signal on that channel. So the message actually had nothing to do with trying to record 2 channels at once.

The error message goes as follows:

RECORDING FAILED TO START
Media Center has encountered an error and is unable to record "Manual Recording". Please restart the computer and then reschedule the recording.
(Recorded TV) (Cancel) (Help)

Now after clicking "Recorded TV" or "Cancel" I can work my way back to "MY TV" and I see that the Analog recording is actually recording fine. And there is no need to restart the computer, so it is a confusing message.

So I will have to try it for you again, and make sure I have both analog and digital signals working.

Thanks,

[Octavean]

Thanks again for the candor of your response.

I look forward to any updates in reference to this issue.

So the error message you just posted was non-applicable due to a “no signal” issue or was this after that issue was addressed? Either way it still doesn’t seem right or within the norm for MCE.

Do keep in mind, however, that the MCE tuner notification messages I posted earlier are really the most appropriate ones for the situation (proper operation) IMO and any significant deviation from them may be indicative of some form of defect. A defect that is very unlikely caused by MCE design and rather likely one of Theater 650 compatibility (tuner non-concurrent design and implementation in MCE),….IMO.

For reference, a MCE PC configured with only a HDTV Wonder (with its analog tuner enabled in addition to its ATSC functionality) will not generate any notification or error messages during conflict. It will record two shows if two are scheduled concurrently (I forget if its analog or digital that is recorded but one is dominant) but only one recording will be good. For what its worth, I think I would prefer no error message or notification over an incorrect error message or notification (reboot or restart MCE) and I would certainly prefer one good recording over no recordings during a conflict. Proper operation in all cases is preferable however.

It is good to know that you have an updated version of the Theater 650 card.

BTW, if you send me a FREE "Improved" Theater 650 card I would be happy to test it for you

Can you please comment on dabl’s post referring to the Theater 650 change in product #

http://forums.hexus.net/showpost.php...&postcount=291

FYI,

--Don

====



http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...&&#post8406411

ati seems to have re-added the 650 back to their product page, and is being advertised on the main page.

The thing is that the item that is listed now, has got a different product.

before recall, it was product # 100-703261.

a few days later when it re-apeared it now has product # 100-715331

A lot of users have speculated that Catalyst Media Center is in fact a relabeled / re-badge of an existing PVR application or upgrade / modification of an existing PVR application. Can you at least confirm if CMC is licensed from a third party or a 100% ATI production? Will modern AIW cards and legacy TV Wonder cards (TV Wonder VE and the like) work with CMC?

I actually have more questions but I don’t want to besiege you with them

Thanks in advance.

Oct.

[fanbanlo]

New 550/650 driver is released today!

Bill T:
Are there release notes / changelog for new 550/650 drivers available?
if not, do you know what's updated in this release?

Thanks.

[Bill T]

Octavean,
Ok, so I just retried it. I made sure I had a proper signal for both analog and digital this time. So when I schedual to record 1 digital, and 1 analog channel at the same time, that same error stated earlier does occur. Though, there is actually no reason to restart anything.
One channel always gets recorded. The dominant channel is the one that the tuner is currently using when the time comes, even if it is not the exact channel. So from the looks of this, the only "problem" is the confusing message that tells you to restart the computer.

My comments on the product number change. The new number must be for the new "improved" version that will be available shortly.

As for the new driver release for the 550/650, I don't know of any release notes for that. And I don't know any details about it, but if you are having any problems, I would recomend that you update your driver.

Some details about CMC:
Catalyst Media Center’s exciting new interface and increased functionality are all designed solely for use with the new TV Wonder products (TV WONDER 650 and TV WONDER 200). ATI has not announced official support for CMC on AIW and previous generation TV Wonder products. These products will continue to be supported under MMC. Please see ati.com for potential updates.

[Seraphic-]

Q. Seraphic- "I still have my TV Wonder 650 and I want to know why it isn't able to also do 640x480? The card does 720x480
fine, but is 640x480 locked/turned off? If yes, when will it be unlocked?"
A - I'm not sure what you are talking about. What software are you using?

I'm using a 3rd party capture application. And when I pick 640x480 it says: "This card does not support the selected format". Did the 550 card have 640x480?

Also, I still have version one of the TV Wonder 650. How do I send it in for the ATI recall? And will I get back a NEW TV Wonder 650 card or a refurbished/used/OEM. I would want back a new card as I picked up the card new.

Last, the new drivers for this card from ATI failed on my system. Maybe this is due to the old card version.

[Octavean]

Wow,..

Great, thanks for the update!

The fact that Theater 650 based cards actually work within the boundaries of it’s concurrent tuner limitation in MCE is great, however, the error message in MCE as you described (erroneous or not) is still an indication of improper MCE functionality, possibly due to said concurrent tuner limitation.

RECORDING FAILED TO START
Media Center has encountered an error and is unable to record "Manual Recording". Please restart the computer and then reschedule the recording.
(Recorded TV) (Cancel) (Help)

The above message is an error message not a typical MCE notification of tuner conflict that would indicate “normal” operation within MCE. Whether a reboot is necessary or not may be of little consequence, clearly something still isn’t right.

If you had said this was with the older recalled design I would have been optimistic that the newer revision would somehow correct this. As it stands now, we can only be hopeful that ATI will somehow correct this before it re-releases theater 650 based products. To do otherwise would almost certainly reflect poorly on ATI with respect to those in the MCE community (MCE users).

I would strongly suggest that a “Knowledge Base” be made available addressing this issue. Furthermore, I would also suggest that all Theater 650 pro based product manuals (third party or otherwise) inform the user of this issue (or via add in pamphlet / flyer) unless it is fixed “BEFORE” the new product actually ships. Since its known now and reproducible there is no reason not to address this issue accordingly,.....

[zob]

I don't know if this information is useful, but read my post at the following link. From what I was told from ATI is the All in Wonder and the TV Wonder 200 are both using the Theater 200 Chip? My question is what prevents me from using the new Catalysts Media Center on my All in Wonder X1900? I was also told that the TV Wonder 200 will support picture in picture on the new All in Wonder cards. I'm only speculating and would like feedback. Thanks...

Since I have not posted five posts it will not let me supply you with the URL link. Sorry but you can go to 3-D rage and read my reply. Sorry for the inconvenience, like they told me.

[buddydogs11]

Well i picked up the 650 today at the local best buy.The card it self looks very nice,but i have problem.I can`t get video overlay(Theatre mode) to work with catalyst media center.I have my PC hooked to my HDTV via component cables and like to surf web while watching TV.