Torque and Power: Who wants to describe them?

[Zak33]

What it says:

Who would like to define, in simple, laymans terms, the definitions of Torque and Power.

To do this you must use these items....
a 100m sprint race trackwith two lanes,
no cars,
2 equal piles of bricks,
two wheel barrows,
and a ninja and a sumo wrestler to move the bricks from one end to the other, racing each other to complete the job

Who wants a go?

[Howard]

Power is torque * speed, in layman's terms, although the equation is somewhat more complex I believe

So the sumo wrestler may have more oomph (torque) to start with (I'm sure he could push/kick the ninja further than the ninja could him) but he doesn't have the overall speed (or rev range ) of the ninja, so the ninja can develop more power over time and end up accelerating faster down the strip with his wheelbarrow


This is my understanding of it anyway

[Zak33]

Power is torque * speed, in layman's terms, although the equation is somewhat more complex I believe

So the sumo wrestler may have more oomph (torque) to start with (I'm sure he could push/kick the ninja further than the ninja could him) but he doesn't have the overall speed (or rev range ) of the ninja, so the ninja can develop more power over time and end up accelerating faster down the strip with his wheelbarrow


This is my understanding of it anyway

3/10

Kind of, but no where good as it could be.

try again chap?

[chriswood_7]

The sumo has more pull but the ninja has more stamina (or ability to do work). I think they would both finish at the same time. However, introduce a hill and the ninja would struggle.

[Zak33]

The sumo has more pull but the ninja has more stamina (or ability to do work). I think they would both finish at the same time. However, introduce a hill and the ninja would struggle.

3.5 /10

Closer...but only by a gnats nadgers

[Howard]

3/10

Kind of, but no where good as it could be.

try again chap?

I'm not technically minded enough to delve into much more detail


I certainly don't think it would be a close race though, the sumo wrestler vs ninja analagy is like comparing a Honda Civic Type R to a 7.5t Royal Mail lorry. The extra weight and less aerodynamics on the sumo wrestler coupled with his lazier torque curve would mean the ninja can cover ground quicker, but the initial torque advantage of the sumo would mean he would get off the mark quicker... Can't really explain it any better than that, heh

[eshrules]

To do this you must use these items....
a 100m sprint race trackwith two lanes,
no cars,
2 equal piles of bricks,
two wheel barrows,
and a ninja and a sumo wrestler to move the bricks from one end to the other, racing each other to complete the job


assuming the two wheel barrows are already loaded, the Sumo would win, hands down.

on a 100 m sprint race track, the torque the Sumo wrestler would develop would enable him to be on his way far sooner than the Ninja, BUT, the Ninja, although 'slower' off the line, due to his lack of initial 'go'/torque, he would soon catch up and overtake the sumo wrestler, due to his superior power.

not only this, but Sumos of course, use chalk for traction, Ninjas have nylon gloves, go figure.


edit - this is possibly completly wrong and not in laymans terms, recognition of such excludes me from any criticism

[Howard]

To do this you must use these items....
a 100m sprint race trackwith two lanes,
no cars,
2 equal piles of bricks,
two wheel barrows,
and a ninja and a sumo wrestler to move the bricks from one end to the other, racing each other to complete the job


assuming the two wheel barrows are already loaded, the Sumo would win, hands down.

on a 100 m sprint race track, the torque the Sumo wrestler would develop would enable him to be on his way far sooner than the Ninja. In fact, the sumo would have reached the finish line, un-wedgied his nappy and started a 10 course feast before the Ninja has even put his sword down, the Ninja would struggle to put all his 'power' down on the racetrack to actually get on his way. (torque's what you need with loads).

not only this, but Sumos of course, use chalk for traction, Ninjas have nylon gloves, go figure.

So if you put 200kg of bricks in a tractor, and another 200kg in a fast light ish road car with a peaky engine, and raced them, you reckon the tractor would win?

[Zak33]

esh...it started well...but fell apart badly.

[eshrules]

esh...it started well...but fell apart badly.

<goes back to edit>

[chriswood_7]

It depends on how far the race was over. Can you remember Jeremy Clarksons comparison between a normal family car and a 300bhp Evo 8? Basically he put it in 6th at 30mph and floored it. And nothing happened. The family car had more torque at that engine speed and therefore won hands down.

So if the race was over 300m then the family car would win. However, if it was over 3000m then Evo would have more time to do more work and therefore win.

[eshrules]

So if you put 200kg of bricks in a tractor, and another 200kg in a fast light ish road car with a peaky engine, and raced them, you reckon the tractor would win?

damnit Howwy, why did you quote me

[eshrules]

It depends on how far the race was over. Can you remember Jeremy Clarksons comparison between a normal family car and a 300bhp Evo 8? Basically he put it in 6th at 30mph and floored it. And nothing happened. The family car had more torque at that engine speed and therefore won hands down.

So if the race was over 300m then the family car would win. However, if it was over 3000m then Evo would have more time to do more work and therefore win.

that wasn't really a fair test though, tbh, and without taking this thread too OT, it simply demonstrated the 'turbo lag' on the evo, rather than a lack of torque/power. the car simply isn't designed to be driven like that

[Shad]

To do this you must use these items....
a 100m sprint race trackwith two lanes,
no cars,
2 equal piles of bricks,
two wheel barrows,
and a ninja and a sumo wrestler to move the bricks from one end to the other, racing each other to complete the job

I think the way to look at it, is the sumo would fill the barrow with all of the bricks and make one trip, because he has the torque to lift and push such a large mass. However, the sprinter is more about getting places quickly and isn't able to shift such large amounts, so may make say 4 trips with half the amount of bricks on each outward leg. In terms of who would win, I think that's irellevent.

The sumo has the big muscles (kind of..) for torque, the sprinter can move his legs quickly for power.

Makes sense to me

[Zak33]

OK..here goes:

The sound of the gun can be heard all the way to the dojo,and the Ninja sprints tohis pile of bricks,while the sumo lumbers to his.

With a quick mental calculation the Ninja realises that he wont be able to even MOVE all those bricks if he tries in one go, so he decides to put a few bricks in and do several journeys.

The Sumo, while waddling towards the bricks, has already sussed that, if he can get them all in the barrow, he could do this in ONE trip.

The Ninja is now sprinting up the track in his lane, with 1 third of the bricks He tips them, and turns and sprints back, realising that he can prolly do this trip several times a ligtning speed and make it to the line first.

The Sumo is still filling his wheel barrow when the Ninja is back to load again. But by the time the Ninja is ha;f way up the track again, the Sumo has loaded them all, grabs the handles, grunts hard, and lifts. He was right...he can do this in one go. He starts to push.

Ninja boy has dumped his load and is running back, but his fore arms are aching, and one more trip with that load will be monster painful, his grip will weaken near the end, but he has no choice. As he passes the Sumo, he sees that the Sumo has already hit top speed, and is making steady progress.

Ninja boy loads ther wheel barrow and starts his final run, his arms on fire, his legs bursting. The Sumo is 2/3's of the way up the course and seems to going a tad faster than a moment ago,but only by a little.

They cross the line and dump their bricks simultaneously.

This equates to IDENTICAL POWER. Both are as powerful as each other. Because, as Howard pointed out earlier, POWER is a combination of how much twist an engine has AND how high it can rev while doing it.

TORQUE is simply the ability to pull at a certain rev range. Big trucks with thunderous amounts of torque produce it at about 1500rpm.


If we wanted to make this even more detailed, we'd put in a whippet, with a man strapping a single brick to it's back and it sprinting up and down, up and down, until it did the job.

That would be a Superbike. A trillion revs and no torque below 12000rpm

[Zak33]

I think the way to look at it, is the sumo would fill the barrow with all of the bricks and make one trip, because he has the torque to lift and push such a large mass. However, the sprinter is more about getting places quickly and isn't able to shift such large amounts, so may make say 4 trips with half the amount of bricks on each outward leg. In terms of who would win, I think that's irellevent.

The sumo has the big muscles (kind of..) for torque, the sprinter can move his legs quickly for power.

Makes sense to me

damn fine....damn fine