The problem with consoles for PC gamers...

[directhex]

if the xbox wasnt there then the developers wouldnt have to mess about dumbing down games and we would get PC-orientated games

Id did the right thing with respect to doom3, making 2 different games. If this had been done with DX2 then it would likely have been a different game.

I critisise that the most as i was really really looking forward to it and was really dissapointed when it turned out to be a simplified Xbox game. You cant tell me that it was designed with both PC and Xbox in mind. The UI is the most obvious expample...

did you read my post at all? -_-

[Spud1]

yes i did read your post =0

And its true that developers are the main ppl we should blame - BUT aside from textures - things like the UI and map size are purely the xbox's fault. If the xbox didnt exist then developers wouldnt be able to be lazy and make poor pc games from good xboxones...

[SilentDeath]

FPS on a pad, autoaim anyone?

Get any counterstrike pr0 (such a crap game, but you have to admit, it probably has the most skilled audience of gamers, assming you exclude all of those which have been playing under 1.5 years)

And any goldeneye "pr0", each with there controler fo chioce.

Then chose a game, which ofcourse can be played by both controlers and also requires the skill of quick aiming. (not sure does CS support gamepads..?) and you will find, the mouse will always win.

[Knoxville]

FPS on a pad, autoaim anyone?

Get any counterstrike pr0 (such a crap game, but you have to admit, it probably has the most skilled audience of gamers, assming you exclude all of those which have been playing under 1.5 years)

And any goldeneye "pr0", each with there controler fo chioce.

Then chose a game, which ofcourse can be played by both controlers and also requires the skill of quick aiming. (not sure does CS support gamepads..?) and you will find, the mouse will always win.

I'll take that bet provided I get a fully configureable n64 controller

[Devilbod]

Ok I'd thought I really kick this off by being a console fan...

I dont see how you can base this all down to the controllers, especaily when you can get both mouse and keypad for consoles and gamepad converters for PC's.
As for the skill of using a analouge joypad (basically a joystick) over a digital mouse I would be very supprised if it was that clear cut, maybe a couple of years ago but now with more kids growing up with Goldeneye, Halo, Timesplitters 2...
Difference for me is one of ease of use: a mouse is really easy to use but with a joypad it takes longer, with a mouse you just get more accurate quicker, joypad you have to get used to it moving quicker and being more accurate at the same time. And because of that you could say it takes more skill to be good with a joypad .
I use my PC for FPS and Stratergy games becuase of the mouse keyboard more than anything else because I used to it. I'm too lazy to spend months being a complete newbie at a game because I'm too used to the other methods of control.

The other main arguement seems to be one of graphics which doesnt make sense to me, I think it's more important what is done with the graphics rather than the quality, I still think that nothing beats Final Fantasy Games purely for the cut scenes they are the best graphics you'll see in a game and thats on a system almost 5 years old, ingame graphics you cry! try Soul Caliber 2 or the animations in Fifa and Madden, or how about the veiw from the peak in SSX 3 or some of the points in the tracks in GT3.
I've been playing Burnout 3 Demo most the morning and its looks great, would it look that good on the PC, probably not but I'd need 'ATI/Nvidia latest version of the same graphics card but this time we have put it together slightly different and tweeked the drivers to make you think spending another £200 is ok and either way it benchmarks faster, graphics card(tm).'
Add to that I'm getting a whole system, that plays games, DVDs, Music CD for roughly the same price of an average graphics card.

A PC may be the best when it come to frist person shooters and stratergy or sim games, but consoles offer more: action game, racing games, sports, platformers, beat 'em ups, puzzle, shoot 'em ups. The only game that seems to work on both is role playing games and at the moment the innovation is happening at the console side of thing, the dance mat, lightguns, the eye toy, Nintendos dual screen..

Even with something like a Fightsim, you can customise a PC to play it perfectly with the right joystick and stuff but that can cost a small fortune.
And considering the cost PC's are a awful gaming platform, to get the best you need to spend over £500 a year to get the best in graphics cards, cpu's, ram, motherboards, internet connection etc. Compatibility issues are still bad having to read 30 odd pages of internet junk to hopefully find a fix for a problem is probably one of the most annoying things in the world.
The developers never get the chance to push a graphics card to its limit because the next card is on the doorstep. Thanks to the internet and the leet haxor culture internet gaming is half full of cheats and half full of everyone moaning about the cheating.
Multiplayer for the PC was better, but these days a console is a damn site easier, not only is it easier for when your mates pop round to set up a console with 4 joypads (or and eye toy or dance mat) but online play is now possible.
With a console you buy the game and it works, it also works to maximum spec infact, theres no 'turn this on or off to increase performance' it just works, I dont have to install it, type in a code, install a drivers patch it, download the latest version....I just play it.

The thing is Halo was designed for a console and works really well on a console just like Goldeneye on the N64 before it, personaly I that really good fps games are getting a lot better on consoles. Timesplitters 3, Halo 2, Killzone, Goldeneye 2 (Rouge Agent - saw a vid of it this morning it does show a great likeness to the original Goldeneye) are all shaping up to be great games, just because your all thumbs with a joypad .

[ed^chigliak]

The problem with consoles for me is that there are already more than enough PC games titles to keep me amused. If I buy a console and play games on that then my PC will get used less often. What's the point of investing in PC hardware and then spending time playing console games? I have a limited amount of time and a limited amount of money for gaming and a PC suits my needs better than a console. Games are cheaper on PC and mods are plentiful so it wouldn't suprise me if the total cost of ownership including game purchase worked out to be pretty similar. Owning a console and a PC will cost pretty much double, time will be divided between the two platforms and there won't be enough hours in the day. For the odd game that is 'exclusive' to a specific platform... well that's just something I will have to sample round at my m8's house.

[Flibb]

Well I use both a PC and Xbox, also have a PS1 plugged into my monitor at work I do play a lot of FPS stuff and for me the PC is the only choice, mainly due to I have the most fun online. The mods for the various games are what got me into FPS, mainly DOD and RO.
I recently read an article about controllers for PC's and consoles written by a dev team porting a console game to the PC. Their take on it was that console controllers make Y axis movement difficult (using thumb sticks you have less movement in your thumbs vertically) this has resulted in games mainly featuring X axis movement. Consequently the number of vertical levels is restricted, or you are not attacked from multiple high and low levels. Also the limited accuracy of hand controllers when compared to a mouse, has resulted in all console games having to have some system of auto-aim in the background, this cant be turned off. So for many console based games the controller is the limiting factor.
The key layout on a keyboard may have been designed to slow down typists, but the layout has no bearing on its use as a game device. In the reality the keyboard in game is a very large pad of buttons laid out to fit where your fingers sit, and you can put your hands where they are the most comfortable as games allow you to configure keys. A lot of money has been spent on controlle design, but a lot has also been spent on keyboard and mouse design, especially when it comes to avoiding RSI over prolonged periods of use.

[Bazzlad]

OK I'm completely a console man, but still play PC games, NOLF, Half-Life (Counter Strike (ish)) Rainbow 6 etc.
The thing that ruins internet games in my eyes is JUMPERS.
You've all played the type....when moving and no-ones around them they still jump. Then they get a rocket launcher jump in circles shooting people while typing:
"hahah n00b"
How is it pleasurable? Here's a tip for developers. Make a Shoulder mounter rocket launcher which SLOWS the player down and makes it UNABLE for him to jump like he has a crocodile in his pants.

I totally agree that DX2 was a console conversion for the PC.

This is true (not as good as DX1, but I played and completed it on XBox, and enjoyed it.) What miffed me off was, it didn't matter what you did through-out the game, the ending scene was completely based on the last levels action. Crock.

You PC gamers are getting a taste of your own medicine. We've had **** PC games shoe-horned onto our lovely Trident shaped control pads for years, I mean look at Duke-Nukem 64, if they'd though about it and set the controls up specifically for the control,. it could have been ace. They didn't.

FPS on a pad, autoaim anyone?

Is turned off on any game I play. Also, PC rainbow 6 auto-aim? Most PC games use it too.

Get any counterstrike pr0 (such a crap game, but you have to admit, it probably has the most skilled audience of gamers, assming you exclude all of those which have been playing under 1.5 years)
And any goldeneye "pr0", each with there controler fo chioce.
Then chose a game, which ofcourse can be played by both controlers and also requires the skill of quick aiming. (not sure does CS support gamepads..?) and you will find, the mouse will always win.

I'd take that challenege. Keyboard and mouse, compared to the gamecube pad, the fluidity is in the TWO analouge sticks. The C-Button stick is as fast as a mouse if you keep the sensitivity up.


What I'm seeing here is courses for horses.


Agent, you want a console? LEARN how to use a pad. It's NOT a disadvantage (unless you buy an X-box: Piece of junk controllers.)
I bought a PC, I didn't try and fit my N64 controller on there.....
Hmmmm.....
*Gets toolkit out*

[Blub2k]

I loved Deus Ex but if my memory serves me correctly then the reason that DX2 was dumbed down was to widen the market and had absolutely NOTHING to do with consoles.l They found that the game was slow to get into and wanted to make the appeal wider and make it easier to get into, in my experience this is true as I had to go back and tell all my mates to try deus ex again and play it for three days at least, they all loved it when they did this, all had given up after about two days. This is why the developers dumbed it down.

[Flibb]

Rainbow 6 has auto aim you can turn off, console games have it in the background, you cant turn it off.

[Bazzlad]

Which console games? Name them.
Goldeneye. Turn it off. Perfect Dark. Turn it off. Time spliters. Turn it off.

[nichomach]

Sorry Blub, I disagree completely; the reason why the levels are tiny in DX2 and the textures are crap is that the Xbox only has 64MB RAM and a crappy intgerated GF-MX graphics controller. Look at how many map loads you get per level; that's purely because of the Xbox's memory limitations and the developers have admitted that. The HUD is completely the fault of the developers; the reason it was put in, though, was because the game was originally developed for the Xbox. They were just too lazy to do anything about it for the PC. As for the inventory, that was designed to be most easily used from a console controller, and the skill system was ditched to simplify the UI for consoles as well. DX2 was dumbed down for the Xbox. That's not the fault of the Xbox itself, but the Xbox does mean that developers are taking the path of least resistance, developing the game for that platform and then doing half-arsed ports to PC.

[MurphmanL]

Give The Chronicles of Riddick a try on the xbox

[MurphmanL]

*Bump*
Why on earth has this thread come to a sudden grounding halt now ive joined in? lol
Mustn't be my lucky day...

[azrael1]

One thing i liek about pc over consols ! TFT ! Means no flickering which can lead to eye problems !

[directhex]

my dreamcast looks nice on my tft