BT phorm Trial results Leaked - *** Thread removed ***

[Saracen]

Sorry guys and gals, but this thread has been removed for legal reasons.

It needs to be looked at, and discussed, and a decision made by HEXUS as to what we do on this. And that will take a little time.

Meantime, please do NOT bring this back up. We'll do what we need to do and let you know ASAP.

Thanks.

[Lee H]

Okay - Fair point I suppose

[chuckskull]

Yeah annoying as it is, not worth risking the site, community and quite a few peoples livelihoods over.

[TiG]

Any possiblility you can elobrate on this?, I mean the BBC has this running as a main story with virtually identical information to the thread we had going here?.

Just interested thats all....

TiG

[usxhe190]

Any possiblility you can elobrate on this?, I mean the BBC has this running as a main story with virtually identical information to the thread we had going here?.

Just interested thats all....

TiG

No need to elobrate...it is all over the news - just do a normal search on any search engine.

[TiG]

No need to elobrate...it is all over the news - just do a normal search on any search engine.

You miss my point, if its all over the news, why have hexus had to pull it for legal reasons.

TiG

[alsenior]

Fair enough i suppose. those who want to look at it can go to the wikileaks front page. it posted up there still. also i noticed that the bbc i reporting on this now.it may now get the attention it deserves.

[usxhe190]

You miss my point, if its all over the news, why have hexus had to pull it for legal reasons.

TiG

Oh sorry...I misunderstood.

But it doesn't matter to me since all the news sources are reporting it and I guess I don't really care whether Hexus reports it or not.

[noTHINGface]

Hexus, for better or worse, seems pretty timid when it comes to these sorts of things, I'm remembering the AACS threads that were killed when the cracked stories broke first time round... Seems a little scaredy cat if the good old beeb and half the internet is running the wikileaks story but there you go, Hexus must do what it thinks is best and so will respect that.

[Saracen]

You miss my point, if its all over the news, why have hexus had to pull it for legal reasons.

TiG

BT and/or Phorm have apparently already used their solicitors over some comments related to the charity ads, and what was or was not done. ANYONE publishing claims and comments, including on the net, and including not just HEXUS but YOU, the members, risk being held to account for what you say, in a court.

Where there is a level of perceived legal risk, we'll remove potentially defamatory material while we look at it, and decide whether it is defamatory or not, and whether the level of risk is justified or not, not least because HEXUS is more likely to get sued than the member actually posting comments.

This is NOT saying that anything in our thread was defamatory, or that the level of risk is high over this. Just that it is high enough that we want to look at it, rather than find out afterwards that it was defamatory by ending up in court and with large legal bills.

Discussion of Phorm and or BT is quite legitimate, and we aren't banning mention of that. We're just asking you all to hold off for a while why we work out precisely what got BT and/or Phorm upset to the point that they went down the legal route with it.

I should stress that this sort of potential for legal exposure, and as I said, members are PERSONALLY at risk over what they say, is an issue we are constantly aware of and monitoring. There is a line between what is freedom of speech and what is defamation, and if you get it wrong, it can get seriously expensive ... by which I mean tens, or hundreds, of thousands of pounds. We need to ensure that we stay on the right side of that line, which means being sure where the line is, and explaining it to you lot.

Because if we get it wrong, it has the potential in extreme circumstances, to result in HEXUS getting shut down. We don't want to take that risk without at least assessing it. So it's a short-term precaution. The thread almost certainly will come back, and very likely exactly as it was before. We just need to be sure.

[neonplanet40]

BT and/or Phorm have apparently already used their solicitors over some comments related to the charity ads, and what was or was not done. ANYONE publishing claims and comments, including on the net, and including not just HEXUS but YOU, the members, risk being held to account for what you say, in a court.

Where there is a level of perceived legal risk, we'll remove potentially defamatory material while we look at it, and decide whether it is defamatory or not, and whether the level of risk is justified or not, not least because HEXUS is more likely to get sued than the member actually posting comments.

This is NOT saying that anything in our thread was defamatory, or that the level of risk is high over this. Just that it is high enough that we want to look at it, rather than find out afterwards that is was defamatory by ending up in court and with large legal bills.

Discussion of Phorm and or BT is quite legitimate, and we aren't banning mention of that. We're just asking you all to hold off for a while why we work out precisely what got BT and/or Phorm upset to the point that they went down the legal route with it.

I should stress that this sort of potential for legal exposure, and as I said, members are PERSONALLY at risk over what they say, is an issue we are constantly aware of and monitoring. There is a line between what is freedom of speech and what is defamation, and if you get it wrong, it can get seriously expensive ... by which I mean tens, or hundreds, of thousands of pounds. We need to ensure that we stay on the right side of that line, which means being sure where the line is, and explaining it to you lot.

Because if we get it wrong, it has the potential in extreme circumstances, to result in HEXUS getting shut down. We don't want to take that risk without at least assessing it. So it's a short-term precaution. The thread almost certainly will come back, and very likely exactly as it was before. We just need to be sure.

Sounds fair enough to me. I think BT is going to be sunk with all this extra publicity though!Serves then right. Well let us know when you guys decide

[Saracen]

Hexus, for better or worse, seems pretty timid when it comes to these sorts of things, I'm remembering the AACS threads that were killed when the cracked stories broke first time round... Seems a little scaredy cat if the good old beeb and half the internet is running the wikileaks story but there you go, Hexus must do what it thinks is best and so will respect that.

A defamation case is complicated, and expensive. It's likely to end up with legal costs of £30k - £50k at a minimum, and it could easily stretch to £250k.

HEXUS doesn't want to fork that out without being sure of what's being said, especially if WE end up paying it because of something one of YOU said.

If that's "scaredy-cat", you can always personally indemnify HEXUS over their legal bills. That way it'll be you taking the risk.

There is no such thing as freedom of speech on the net. You can, and in some circumstances, will be held to account for what is said, and quite rightly too. And, as a "publisher", HEXUS can be held to account for what members say.

[Lucio]

Well thanks for the concise explanation as to why it's been removed.

[noTHINGface]

Of course any legal risk has to be considered and can prove expensive and you have to limit your exposure to that risk.

IANAL but I don't believe there is any such legislation stating that publishers are accountable by law - though there are plenty of groups who would like there to be so of course! Hence why we read so many cases of companies miss using copyright and/or IP law to have sites remove negative reviews about them etc... Feeding the so called Streisand effect. The paragraph “The views represented by respondents represent ... etc" is quite commonplace.

Either way - as I said in my previous post, I respect your choices, it's your site and I like it here

[chuckskull]

I'd also like to say thanks for the concise explanation and possibly stopping me being sued

People need to remember that even if Hexus is in 'the right' a major court case against a large company would have devastating effects to the site even if they won eventually(which can often take years).

[TiG]

BT and/or Phorm have apparently already used their solicitors over some comments related to the charity ads, and what was or was not done. ANYONE publishing claims and comments, including on the net, and including not just HEXUS but YOU, the members, risk being held to account for what you say, in a court.

Where there is a level of perceived legal risk, we'll remove potentially defamatory material while we look at it, and decide whether it is defamatory or not, and whether the level of risk is justified or not, not least because HEXUS is more likely to get sued than the member actually posting comments.

This is NOT saying that anything in our thread was defamatory, or that the level of risk is high over this. Just that it is high enough that we want to look at it, rather than find out afterwards that is was defamatory by ending up in court and with large legal bills.

Discussion of Phorm and or BT is quite legitimate, and we aren't banning mention of that. We're just asking you all to hold off for a while why we work out precisely what got BT and/or Phorm upset to the point that they went down the legal route with it.

I should stress that this sort of potential for legal exposure, and as I said, members are PERSONALLY at risk over what they say, is an issue we are constantly aware of and monitoring. There is a line between what is freedom of speech and what is defamation, and if you get it wrong, it can get seriously expensive ... by which I mean tens, or hundreds, of thousands of pounds. We need to ensure that we stay on the right side of that line, which means being sure where the line is, and explaining it to you lot.

Because if we get it wrong, it has the potential in extreme circumstances, to result in HEXUS getting shut down. We don't want to take that risk without at least assessing it. So it's a short-term precaution. The thread almost certainly will come back, and very likely exactly as it was before. We just need to be sure.

Thanks Saracen, I was just interested in understanding the view behind this. I'm fine with hexus being a commercial entity and needing to do what it needs to do in its own eyes. I was just curious how/what you viewed the more indepth reasons as.

Thanks again
TiG