Drive the M4?

[Allen]

The same can happen at 60 or 70mph and the resultwill be the same. How many people do you think that when faced with a tyre blowout are actually gonna know what to do? I should think a good 60% of the population would freeze and just let the accident happen because they don't know what to do. So in that instance speed is irrelevnt.

I'm not talking about if you had a blowout, I'm talking about someone else having any sort of problem, not just a blowout which causes them to fly infront of the car you're driving.

I think the main point here is that speed doesn't kill, its the innaproppriate use of speed that does. By your definition Allen anyone doing 71mph is a speeder, a dangerous driver and should be penalised for it.

That's not exactly what I'm saying. The faster you go the more chance you have of being a dangerous driver, therefore personally I relate speed to danger in that sense. I've said before there should be some kind of tolerence level, 71mph isn't enough to justify punishment.

I think what should happen is that they update the antiquated motorway speeding limit (first set when cars struggled to 70mph) to a more realistic 85-9mph. This would then coincide with the safer vehicles we drive today compared to the 60s and would mean that we would have more realistic idea of speeding.

I don't doubt motorways are built to make diving faster safe and I've also said before that I have no doubt that new cars can handle the faster speed and/or braking if necessary, but not everyone has new cars and certainly not everyone is a sensible driver and can handle themselves at faster speeds.

What I think should happen is to stop the reliance on speed cameras and bring back the traffic police like they had in the 80's when speeding wasn't such a big issue because of these officers.

Place speed cameras around schools and hospitals etc but not on motorways, thats not safety; thats money grabbing.

Totally agree with that. I am pro camera, but cameras are only designed to stop speeding and they should be used in better places. Police presence on the road will (hopefully) stop a whole multitude of bad driving incidents, not just speed related ones.

Traffice police would also be far more likely to be aware of time, conditions etc and be able to have the power of discretion. Speed cameras don't catch middle lane hoggers, tail gaters, people not indicating, people driving dangerously they just pick on speeders. Alot of accidents are caused by bad driving and not by speed.

I freely admit I drive at 80mph on the motorways and do so with a 3-4 car length gap in front of me and do so if the conditions are ok (ie not driving rain or thick fog) but have nearly had accidents on the motorways at slower speeds in the left/middle lane due to planks who are bad drivers but not speeders who pull out in front at slower speeds without indicating for example.

I know not all accidents are caused by speed, and I very much doubt that there are any incidents that are solely caused by speed alone (i.e. there has to be some other factor, collision, falling asleep, something in the road, blown tyre etc) but moving at a higher speed must surely increase the possibility of causing injuries and fatalities (and I only think that from common sense, not from what I've seen or figures I've read - I don't claim to be an expert or to have seen thousands of major accidents with my own eyes like some people think).

Instead of penalising people for speeding they should be educating the bad drivers (whether they be speeders or not) which can only be achieved through the judicious use of speed cameras and through better traffic policing....

And i'm spent

They should be doing both IMO, educate and penalise speeders AND bad drivers. I can see this as the only option to make our roads safer, not by increasing the speed limit.

[Zak33]

I'm still waiting for some actual new rules for the road from people who think the 70 limit is unacceptable.

this thread is huge and goes in two direction now but I THINK Trig listed a few.

Speed limits lower around schools, more cop cars, speed limit on motorways up a tad, etc.

All sounded ok to me tbh...if I could FIND the blasted things I'd post them.

Who ever split/duplicated this thread needs a slap.....

/looks around for David

Oih boss...you dunarf make our lives hard....modding two threads

[Zak33]

ooh Flibbs put some up /\ there

[Allen]

Oih boss...you dunarf make our lives hard....modding two threads

Perhaps he wanted to maximize the carnage?

[Flibb]

Some numbers from UK department of transport, and some bits from the times online

Motorways account for a fifth of road traffic.
In 2003, 184 people died on motorways compared with 1,890 on rural roads, 1,434 died on urban roads.


3,508 people were killed in road accidents in 2003
33,707 were seriously injured
253,392 were slightly injured

More than two thirds of all accidents in which people are killed or seriously injured happen on roads where the speed limit is 40mph or less.

[Allen]

More than two thirds of all accidents in which people are killed or seriously injured happen on roads where the speed limit is 40mph or less.

And what percentage of those were travelling faster than the legal speed limit, out of curiosity?

[iranu]

Some numbers from UK department of transport, and some bits from the times online

Motorways account for a fifth of road traffic.
In 2003, 184 people died on motorways compared with 1,890 on rural roads, 1,434 died on urban roads.


3,508 people were killed in road accidents in 2003
33,707 were seriously injured
253,392 were slightly injured

More than two thirds of all accidents in which people are killed or seriously injured happen on roads where the speed limit is 40mph or less.

The perfect counter argument to those that think SPEED ALONE KILLS.

Motorways are the safest roads. FACT. They are also the fastest roads. FACT. So if they are so safe, why are the local authorities investing in speed cameras on the M4?

It is not for safety reasons. They would better off putting those cameras at dangerous spots where there is a known risk.

Reason: They want to increase revenue.

[Flibb]

I havent a clue the text was directly lifted from the site.

I personally think there should be more speed cameras in 20-40 limit areas, think most people would support that.


But 15% of fatal crashes involved drink. 20% of motorway and trunk road accidents involve tirednes. 50% of people tested after accidents the other year had large amounts of medicationg drugs in their blood stream, why dont people think "dont operate heavy machinery" includes cars?

Around here they put up a speed camera after a speeding accident, but the bloke was dong 80 in a 30 and was pisssed out of his head after partying in london and getting the last train back.

[fondie]

I'm still waiting for some actual new rules for the road from people who think the 70 limit is unacceptable.

Some of the same points as Flibb but -

There should be no speed limits on motorways, policemen should be on hand to catch those driving without due care and attention (mobile phones etc), dangerous driving, tailgaters, aggressive drivers, middle lane cruisers etc.

Speed limits on dual carriageways and on rural roads with good conditions should be increased upwards with greater signage to warn of potential hazards in the road ahead, possibly signage with a suggested speeds for tight bends, hidden dips etc.

Speed cameras along with appropriate signage should only be located in areas of high pedestrian risk, such as schools. Speed cameras and speed camera signs should be removed in all other areas.

[iranu]

I personally would not be happy with no limit. Motorways are designed for fast driving, yes, but not 130mph. Also this would not take into account weather conditions or traffic density etc.

I would say that an upper limit of 85mph (+10% error) would be about right (along with a better system of variable speed limit for when theres bad weather etc) Although 100mph is certainly safe WHEN the right conditions apply. Start going over 100 and I think that many drivers would not be comfortable at this speed.

Currently the majority of (commuting) drivers travel about 75-85mph.

I agree with the rest of what fondie says.

[fondie]

Sure some people will not be comfortable with 100mph, and many cars will not (my car doesn't even reach 100), but it is only a limit, it isn't necessary to travel at that speed. Also if traffic, weather, road conditions aren't favourable then it is the drivers job to adjust their speed accordingly, and it is the police's job to enforce that.