Help me with buying a new PC please

[Blitzen]

oh, just one more thing (now i sound like columbo), if i was to spend £2500 on a pc, i would want at least 2 graphics cards in there... but thats just me

Too right...i would aswell.

[tickedon]

Personally, I used to go down the route of spending a fortune on the latest and greatest and replacing less regularly with minor upgrades. The days of £380 graphics cards are well and truly over for me

Now, I spend half of what I used to - but replace twice as often and add a few bits as I go. Technology moves so fast, that any sort of future-proofing is generally not going to work out.

I did cheap out a bit in January this year as I needed a laptop as well, and following my pattern I would normally replace in a couple of months, where I'll probably go for a Q6600/Q8200 - I think prudence might be appropriate in this climate The i7 stuff is nice but expensive, and hopefully in another year or so I'll be able to get that and see if USB3 is appearing yet.

That said, if you can afford £2.5k every year, go for it and enjoy yourself

[Zadock]

Sorted you should have my direct email address now.
Regards

Awww look at that, putting business your way there Paulm do I get commission?

[Robscure]

Here's a new spec... What do you think of this?

3XS Intel X58 Core i7

Base Specifications



Antec Twelve Hundred Case

3XS X58 Core i7 System

Asus P6T Deluxe - Intel X58 - Sok 1366

2 x 120mm AK-183-L2B Akasa Amber Case Fan

Akasa 8 Pin Extension cable

Thermalright Ultra 120A & Ultra120 eXtreme 120mm Fan Wire Clips

Thermalright LGA1366 Bolt-Thru-Kit

Silverstone FP51B Black Transfer Bracket

Acronis True Image Home 2009

Scan 3XS System - 1year Onsite Warranty (Mainland UK)

Scan System Configuration

Scan System Configuration (Details confirmed at checkout stage)





Qty
Selected Specifications



1
*No Custom Colour Required*

1
Intel i7 920, Nehalem, 2.66GHz, 4.8GT/s QPI, 8MB Cache, Retail

1
Thermalright Ultra 120 eXtreme 120mm Heat Sink Fan

1
3XS System Core-Logic Overclocking*10 - 20%*

1
3GB (3x1GB) Corsair Dominator DDR3, PC3-12800 (1600) CAS 8-8-8-24

1
1GB XFX GTX 280, 2210MHz GDDR3, 602MHz GPU, 240 Cores (Far Cry2 Included while stocks last)

1
*No ATI VGA Card Required* (NVIDIA Required)

1
620W Corsair HX Series Modular PSU (Single Graphics Card)

1
640 GB Samsung HD642JJ Spinpoint F1, 7200 rpm, 16MB Cache

1
1000 GB Samsung HD103UJ Spinpoint F1, 7200 rpm, 32MB Cache

1
*Solid State Drive Not Required*

1
Akasa 3.5" Internal Multi Memory Card reader & USB 2.0 Port

1
Pioneer DVR-216DBK 20x DVD±R, 12x DVD±DL, DVD+RW x8/-RW x6

1
*Blu Ray Not Required*

1
Creative Sound Blaster X-Fi Titanium Sound Card 7.1Ch

1
*Use On Board Network Port*

1
*Wireless Adaptor Not Required*

1
*After Market Fans Not Required - Use Fans Included with Case*

2
Sharkoon 12" Blue CCFL 2in1 Kit

1
Microsoft Windows Vista Home Premium 64Bit

1
MS OFFICE 2007 - 25 Usage/60 Day TRIAL Basic,SBE & Professional

1
Cyberlink Power DVD V7

1
*No Software Required*

1
*No Software Required*

1
26" iiyama E2607WS-B1, Black Widescreen LCD, 1920x1200, 4000:1

1
*Gaming Keyboard Not Required*

1
*Gaming Mouse Not Required*

1
*Gaming Mouse Mat Not Required*

1
*Speakers Not Required*

1
Standard 3XS System Warranty


£2122.33

[Mossy]

Awww look at that, putting business your way there Paulm do I get commission?

I don't get commision so you surely don't, but thank you i am going to look after the OP hopefully we can come to some arrangement take time and effort and it always comes good.

[Robscure]

I don't get commision so you surely don't, but thank you i am going to look after the OP hopefully we can come to some arrangement take time and effort and it always comes good.

I'm the "OP" what is "OP"?

lol, if so, thanks for looking after me...

[MSIC]

OP = Original Poster (as far as I know!).
Looks like a fair old system now, it'll certainly feel 'special' and run like something coming off a slippery shovel.

PS Zaddock, am loving your avatar. I want to copy it. Can we be avatar buddies ?

[Robscure]

OP = Original Poster (as far as I know!).
Looks like a fair old system now, it'll certainly feel 'special' and run like something coming off a slippery shovel.

PS Zaddock, am loving your avatar. I want to copy it. Can we be avatar buddies ?

Can you please explain what makes this new spec better than the previous spec?

The previous one, I was told is too expensive, will run too hot, over-the-top, etc...

To my untrained eyes they look almost identicle except for the switch from Radeon 4870 to Nvidia GTX 280....

Thanks

[MSIC]

That's quite fair, and to be honest i never said the old one wasn't good enough.
Truth be told, i didnt really look at it, and just joined this thread late on.
Shame on me

I do think however that you're getting the 'Scan effect' which is that many people who post at Hexus are quite loyal or at least in favour of Scan, based on good personal experience. So if you see 2 similar or identical objects, one sold by Scan, that's the one we'll (generally) warm to.

Now that i've actually looked at you original spec (which is quite hard to read by the way - have you ever considered formatting! LOL), i agree that it's also a fast system.

[Robscure]

That's quite fair, and to be honest i never said the old one wasn't good enough.
Truth be told, i didnt really look at it, and just joined this thread late on.
Shame on me

I do think however that you're getting the 'Scan effect' which is that many people who post at Hexus are quite loyal or at least in favour of Scan, based on good personal experience. So if you see 2 similar or identical objects, one sold by Scan, that's the one we'll (generally) warm to.

Now that i've actually looked at you original spec (which is quite hard to read by the way - have you ever considered formatting! LOL), i agree that it's also a fast system.

lol sorry

Yes, I like Scan, they seem good to me, and I like the customer service (Paul inc., lol).

Are the specs on this Scan PC good? Do you think the i7 is unnecessary? Should I go with an E8600 instead? Or perhaps Quad Core?

I'm going to be playing Warhammer Online...

Maybe Call of Duty 5...

I don't like to play at 1900 resolution with MAX settings lol... maybe 1280 resolution at most...

[MSIC]

I don't like to play at 1900 resolution with MAX settings lol... maybe 1280 resolution at most...

What are you doing buying this system then!!!!
A £500 machine will be perfect for 1280 x 1024 gaming....
As for Quad Core or whatever, yes of course anything Core2Duo/Quad-based is good enough for all current games, and for the next few years too, but you seem set on Core i7, so fair enough. It's not good value right now, but it is powerful.

Seriously though, is it the resolution you dont like (if so... why???) or the physical size?

At my work, we have admin workers who "hate that high resolution" because they have to squint (on a 17" 4:3 monitor). But if you're proposing buying a 26" monitor, it'd be crazy to run at anything less...
1280 x 1024 resolution on a 26" monitor would end up looking a bit like teletext from 1985.

[NeedMoarFarms]

My system right now, which you could probably buy for about £600 now can run every game (except crysis) at max settings at 1400*900.

I'd really look into building your own or getting someone to build for you. It will be much, much cheaper and so much more upgradeable.

There isn't any point in spending £2500 on a machine that will only play WAR and CoD5. A £500 rig will still be able to play all the top games next year.

[Robscure]

What are you doing buying this system then!!!!
A £500 machine will be perfect for 1280 x 1024 gaming....
As for Quad Core or whatever, yes of course anything Core2Duo/Quad-based is good enough for all current games, and for the next few years too, but you seem set on Core i7, so fair enough. It's not good value right now, but it is powerful.

Seriously though, is it the resolution you dont like (if so... why???) or the physical size?

At my work, we have admin workers who "hate that high resolution" because they have to squint (on a 17" 4:3 monitor). But if you're proposing buying a 26" monitor, it'd be crazy to run at anything less...
1280 x 1024 resolution on a 26" monitor would end up looking a bit like teletext from 1985.

lol... It's not that I'm set on Core i7... I just thought it may be a better deal, but I could be wrong!

I think I will go with the E8600... It will work fine and by the time games need Quad, there will be a new i7 with a new mobo to be upgraded to in order to do the job, I think!

(Remember, this is all speculation from me, I really know very little, my knowledge has just come from countless hours of forum-searching, review-reading, and using custom building on websites...)

So, on to the reason I dont' want 1900... I haven't played FPS since 2004, really... When the pro-gamers were playing CS:S @ 1024x768... That's what I picture to be the perfect resolution for pro-gaming.

I don't care about eye candy as much as I care about seeing the enemy and shooting him before he shoots you. I want to be fast and efficient.

I think 24" is too big... I was thinking 22", but maybe even that is too big.

And I don't know how efficient widescreen is for gaming... Are the resolutions the same or different on widescreen?

See, I'm relatively oldschool... I mainly played CoD2 on an old Dell with an EVGA Nvidia Geforce FX 5700 ultra, which I used for many years.

I'm going to go for a less powerful machine because I see now that everything I've been getting is geared at playing max settings and max resolution on three displays Crysis... I don't even think Crysis is a competitive multiplayer title... but then again, I haven't been on the scene since CoD2 was in CPL.

Keep posting feedback though guys, I appreciate it.

Post what you consider to be an ideal gaming PC for someone who is competitive and not interested in playing on three displays with 1900 resolution and what-not...

[MSIC]

OK, well first of all don't worry about asking what might seem to be silly questions - before you pay your money is the time to make mistakes and ask questions, not after!

So let's clarify what your objectives are, rather than your PC spec as such. Once you are clear with what you want to achieve, you'll be much happier with the result.

It sounds like you want a PC for gaming, which is great. Do you want to do anything else with it, like video editing? I'm sure you'll want to do some web browsing etc, but it's worth being clear at this stage.

Does the size of the base unit (the actual "computer") matter to you? Do you fancy a small 'shuttle' type, or is a large tower ok? Do you want it to be portable? Or even just 'lug-able'?

How about noise? Would something that sounds like an old fridge freezer bother you, or would you find the benefit in near-silence?

What about power-draw? I'm guessing that with that sort of budget it might not make a difference to you, but you might be an environmentalist at heart

The other questions i have for you relate you your previous experiences, which from the sounds of it are quite out of date (not trying to be nasty, just honest).
When i got my 20" widescreen monitor, my initial thoughts were "wow thats big" but i soon adjusted, and now cant wait to get something bigger. You are aware that the Scan spec you posted above had a 26" monitor? I'd love a 26", but in a small room (particularly if it's a 'family' room) it might look out of place. It all depends on how much you want or are happy to have the PC 'stand out'.

Your idea about a lower resolution for 'pro gaming' probably was true back in the dark ages (2004), however computer grunt has come on to the point where modern games have to be turned up to maximum (not just resolution but also the in game effects, and AA etc) just to start to tax it a little. And by 'a little' i mean, in the case of a 4870 or 280GTX dipping below 60 fps in most games at 1920 x 1200 resolution. You could almost argue that graphics chip makers are developing themselves out of a market since nearly all graphics cards from £50 upwards are easily good enough for 1280 x 1024, and the next generation £50 will comfortably do 1680 x 1050 i'm sure. So spending £250 on a graphics card means you absolutely have to game at 1920 x 1200 AS A MINIMUM, if not going the whole 30" hog!!
A current Radeon 4550 (costing £40) would wipe the floor graphically with a 5700 ultra, as well as wattage-draw, noise polution, heat production, size... you get the idea.

As for widescreen 'efficiency' (ie how common or good it is), again back in 2004 it was a real hassle. Check out widescreen gaming forum for all the 'hacks' that had to be developed by players to get things to work semi-ok (DICE were absolutely rubbish with their stance on Battlefield 2). But again, that was then and this is now. Widescreen is not just the future, it's the present, and i'd be surprised if anyone was seriously considering a 4:3 ratio monitor for their next upgrade.

My other, more general rule of thumb, or to consider the peripherals first. By these, i mean specifically the monitor, speakers, mouse and keyboard (plus webcam, scanner, printer and whatever else). Spend around a third (oe even half!) of your overall budget on these, because they should last you longer then the internal base unit components which will devalue quicker. A good monitor and speakers should last you years.

Hope that helps, i'm happy to give any more advice if i can.

[Blitzen]

Here's a new spec... What do you think of this?

3XS Intel X58 Core i7

Base Specifications



Antec Twelve Hundred Case

3XS X58 Core i7 System

Asus P6T Deluxe - Intel X58 - Sok 1366

2 x 120mm AK-183-L2B Akasa Amber Case Fan

Akasa 8 Pin Extension cable

Thermalright Ultra 120A & Ultra120 eXtreme 120mm Fan Wire Clips

Thermalright LGA1366 Bolt-Thru-Kit

Silverstone FP51B Black Transfer Bracket

Acronis True Image Home 2009

Scan 3XS System - 1year Onsite Warranty (Mainland UK)

Scan System Configuration

Scan System Configuration (Details confirmed at checkout stage)





Qty
Selected Specifications



1
*No Custom Colour Required*

1
Intel i7 920, Nehalem, 2.66GHz, 4.8GT/s QPI, 8MB Cache, Retail

1
Thermalright Ultra 120 eXtreme 120mm Heat Sink Fan

1
3XS System Core-Logic Overclocking*10 - 20%*

1
3GB (3x1GB) Corsair Dominator DDR3, PC3-12800 (1600) CAS 8-8-8-24

1
1GB XFX GTX 280, 2210MHz GDDR3, 602MHz GPU, 240 Cores (Far Cry2 Included while stocks last)

1
*No ATI VGA Card Required* (NVIDIA Required)

1
620W Corsair HX Series Modular PSU (Single Graphics Card)

1
640 GB Samsung HD642JJ Spinpoint F1, 7200 rpm, 16MB Cache

1
1000 GB Samsung HD103UJ Spinpoint F1, 7200 rpm, 32MB Cache

1
*Solid State Drive Not Required*

1
Akasa 3.5" Internal Multi Memory Card reader & USB 2.0 Port

1
Pioneer DVR-216DBK 20x DVD±R, 12x DVD±DL, DVD+RW x8/-RW x6

1
*Blu Ray Not Required*

1
Creative Sound Blaster X-Fi Titanium Sound Card 7.1Ch

1
*Use On Board Network Port*

1
*Wireless Adaptor Not Required*

1
*After Market Fans Not Required - Use Fans Included with Case*

2
Sharkoon 12" Blue CCFL 2in1 Kit

1
Microsoft Windows Vista Home Premium 64Bit

1
MS OFFICE 2007 - 25 Usage/60 Day TRIAL Basic,SBE & Professional

1
Cyberlink Power DVD V7

1
*No Software Required*

1
*No Software Required*

1
26" iiyama E2607WS-B1, Black Widescreen LCD, 1920x1200, 4000:1

1
*Gaming Keyboard Not Required*

1
*Gaming Mouse Not Required*

1
*Gaming Mouse Mat Not Required*

1
*Speakers Not Required*

1
Standard 3XS System Warranty


£2122.33

Still doesnt look like alot for £2000+

Only 3gb RAM (may be enough)
Only a Corsair 620W (would be enough but for £2K would want more)
Only a 1tb HDD (again, enough but not alot for the cash)

[Robscure]

OK, well first of all don't worry about asking what might seem to be silly questions - before you pay your money is the time to make mistakes and ask questions, not after!

So let's clarify what your objectives are, rather than your PC spec as such. Once you are clear with what you want to achieve, you'll be much happier with the result.

It sounds like you want a PC for gaming, which is great. Do you want to do anything else with it, like video editing? I'm sure you'll want to do some web browsing etc, but it's worth being clear at this stage.

Does the size of the base unit (the actual "computer") matter to you? Do you fancy a small 'shuttle' type, or is a large tower ok? Do you want it to be portable? Or even just 'lug-able'?

How about noise? Would something that sounds like an old fridge freezer bother you, or would you find the benefit in near-silence?

What about power-draw? I'm guessing that with that sort of budget it might not make a difference to you, but you might be an environmentalist at heart

The other questions i have for you relate you your previous experiences, which from the sounds of it are quite out of date (not trying to be nasty, just honest).
When i got my 20" widescreen monitor, my initial thoughts were "wow thats big" but i soon adjusted, and now cant wait to get something bigger. You are aware that the Scan spec you posted above had a 26" monitor? I'd love a 26", but in a small room (particularly if it's a 'family' room) it might look out of place. It all depends on how much you want or are happy to have the PC 'stand out'.

Your idea about a lower resolution for 'pro gaming' probably was true back in the dark ages (2004), however computer grunt has come on to the point where modern games have to be turned up to maximum (not just resolution but also the in game effects, and AA etc) just to start to tax it a little. And by 'a little' i mean, in the case of a 4870 or 280GTX dipping below 60 fps in most games at 1920 x 1200 resolution. You could almost argue that graphics chip makers are developing themselves out of a market since nearly all graphics cards from £50 upwards are easily good enough for 1280 x 1024, and the next generation £50 will comfortably do 1680 x 1050 i'm sure. So spending £250 on a graphics card means you absolutely have to game at 1920 x 1200 AS A MINIMUM, if not going the whole 30" hog!!
A current Radeon 4550 (costing £40) would wipe the floor graphically with a 5700 ultra, as well as wattage-draw, noise polution, heat production, size... you get the idea.

As for widescreen 'efficiency' (ie how common or good it is), again back in 2004 it was a real hassle. Check out widescreen gaming forum for all the 'hacks' that had to be developed by players to get things to work semi-ok (DICE were absolutely rubbish with their stance on Battlefield 2). But again, that was then and this is now. Widescreen is not just the future, it's the present, and i'd be surprised if anyone was seriously considering a 4:3 ratio monitor for their next upgrade.

My other, more general rule of thumb, or to consider the peripherals first. By these, i mean specifically the monitor, speakers, mouse and keyboard (plus webcam, scanner, printer and whatever else). Spend around a third (oe even half!) of your overall budget on these, because they should last you longer then the internal base unit components which will devalue quicker. A good monitor and speakers should last you years.

Hope that helps, i'm happy to give any more advice if i can.

Thanks so much for this amazing reply, you're a good man.

Will you do me a favor and email me, I'd like to go into better detail, I think you can help me a lot in building the right PC for me... add me to MSN Messenger please if you can, and we can talk on there

I'm going to PM you my email.