Questions on watercooling

[Englander]

I've been speccing a CPU only loop largely using information from old Hexus threads and other corners of the internet. The objective is to keep it as cheap as possible (I'm aware that this may at first seem a contradiction with watercooling) This is what I've come up with so far:

Maximum budget: £175 (note: also see my Wanted thread http://forums.hexus.net/wanted/17863...ator-sale.html)

Pump: £67.08
£51.08 Laing DDC 18w Pump
http://www.chilledpc.co.uk/shop/prod...roducts_id=181
+
£16 XSPC DDC reservoir (courtesy of Peterstoba)

CPU block: £22.50
£22.50 D-Tek Fuzion V1 incl. chrome barbs and backplate (courtesy of Gonzo)

GPU block: £15.00
£15.00 EK GPU block (courtesy of Finlay)

Radiator: £52.24
£40.00 Thermochill PA120.3 (courtesy of Finlay)
+
£12.24 3x YATE LOON 120mm - D12SL-12
http://www.chilledpc.co.uk/shop/prod...products_id=48

Tubing: £4.00
£4.00 XSPC 7/16" ID - 6/8" OD High Flex Tubing clear (courtesy of Peterstoba)

Coolant: £7.60
£2.50 for 2.5l @ Tesco's Distilled water
+
£5.10 Silver coil
http://www.chilledpc.co.uk/shop/prod...oducts_id=1196


Total: £168.24
_________________________________________________________________________

Proposed Loop
Pump + res --> radiator --> CPU block --> GPU block --> pump + res

Regarding compatibility, is that all ok? Apparently you shouldn't use more than one type of metal in a loop... What could be better, without pushing up the price a lot? The ASUS P5N-T Deluxe is covered in a network of heat pipes so NB/MOSFET/all the other little blocks you can get won't be required, I reckon. My 8800GT has one of those Arctic Cooler Accelero with 2 fans on it. I'm very pleased with the noise level/temperature of this so I don't want to spend £50-£60 on a graphics card block. The other thing with graphics card blocks is that I'm not sure how "future proof" they are should I upgrade my 8800GT in the future.

I'm aware fans need to be supplied as well, I have one Noctua on my CPU cooler and could get another to make a pair. Incidentally, is a 120.2 radiator necessary for just a CPU? What would be the effect of dropping down to 120.1?

The barbs I linked to, are they sold singly or in pairs? I've worked out that I'd need six barbs (2 for the pump, rad and CPU block) plus potentially two more depending on the outcome of my question about T lines.

Where are radiators typically mounted in a case?

For the coolant, I would just use distilled water + some sort of biocide.

Lots of questions, I know, sorry!
Thanks,
Michael

[mikemikemi]

CPU tops have little effect on performance, unless there have been design changes, generally the choice is for aesthetics and copper/delrin tops tend to be preferred to reduce risks of cracking.

I prefer T-lines, although they do make bleeding the system more difficult.

With two metals in the loop generally implying copper and Alu, the alu will corrode. However, there are few alu parts out there to buy now. I generally avoid any alu, which isn't too hard and shouldn't affect the cost.

Swiftech do a GPU block, which is universally compatible with most cards (you may need to buy new mounting brackets), therefore for future upgrades, ram sinks + new GPU mount tend to be less expensive than a new full cover block.

How much radiator you have is generally dependent on what you want out of watercooling, e.g., higher overclock or less noise. I've seen many people disappointed with watercooling, thinking it will magically give them much lower temps. If you go with a single 120 rad, it probably won't be much better than highend air such as the TRUE.

Barbs tend to be sold singly.

Radiators, depends on your case, it's quite common these days for people to use a rad box and hang radiators off the back of the case, or cut some holes and mount it in the top?

Routing, many go radiator first under the reasoning that the cpu will then get the coolest water as if comes straight from the rad, this does make sense as there is a difference in radiator water in and out temps.

Distilled water and PT nuke is a good combo. Battery top up water from halfords is what i used and is pretty cheap.

[Englander]

Stuff

Thanks very much, that's quite a few questions bopped on the head there

I'll have to go and do a bit more research on T-lines, then and I'll have a peek at the Swiftech GPU block you mentioned.

I'm also finding it surprisingly tricky to match the metals from their descriptions. The water block says copper baseplate, so I suppose the supposition there is that it's all copper? No mention of a metal in the pump, so does the pump not matter in all this galvanic corrosion business? As for radiators, the few I've looked at are all brass with copper fins - is that going to have an issue with the copper CPU block?

[Million]

Just to influence the advice you receive, what are you trying to get out of water-cooling your computer?

[Englander]

Just to influence the advice you receive, what are you trying to get out of water-cooling your computer?

Largely performance (I'm a keen overclocker) and reduction in noise, also to do as a project after my exams.

[mikemikemi]

Largely performance (I'm a keen overclocker) and reduction in noise, also to do as a project after my exams.

If performance is what you want at a minimum I would stick to the 2x120 rad then. if you can fit a 3x120mm rad this would give you more head room (cooling capacity) if you plan on adding the gpu to the loop.

7/16 tubing is tight to get on 1/2" barbs, but I would never recommend going without clamps, considering the potential risk of frying your pc; many don't like clamps because of aesthetics, but if this is an issue then there are better looking clamps out there. Zip ties can work if you get them on tight, but remember you may want to take your rig apart at some point. I just use the screw ones commonly found at B&Q.

So far in your current spec, I can't see any metal issues, brass and copper are fine, it's only when alu and copper are in the same loop that you will get problems.

[Englander]

If performance is what you want at a minimum I would stick to the 2x120 rad then. if you can fit a 3x120mm rad this would give you more head room (cooling capacity) if you plan on adding the gpu to the loop.

7/16 tubing is tight to get on 1/2" barbs, but I would never recommend going without clamps, considering the potential risk of frying your pc; many don't like clamps because of aesthetics, but if this is an issue then there are better looking clamps out there. Zip ties can work if you get them on tight, but remember you may want to take your rig apart at some point. I just use the screw ones commonly found at B&Q.

So far in your current spec, I can't see any metal issues, brass and copper are fine, it's only when alu and copper are in the same loop that you will get problems.

I greatly appreciate the help you're giving me.

I'm content with a 2x120 rad at the moment. I think it's a nice balance between performance and cost, especially considering I'll leave out the GPU for now. The only thing is that I asked on another forum and he said that this particular rad was a bit rubbish and I'm having trouble finding any review round ups of moderately more budget rads. Internet consensus seems to be go with a Thermochill PA12.x but if I can save £10/£20 on something just a bit worse, then I would be happy to do that.

Aesthetics isn't a massive issue so I'll most likely use zip ties seeing as I've got plenty to hand, and I read you can just use nail scissors to chop them off.

Thanks for the tip about mixing metals, I'll bear that in mind when I'm looking around

[PeterStoba]

7/16" tubing over 1/2" barbs is fine without clamps or ties. Dip the ends in hot water and push it over the barbs, it's not going anywhere. I've been running two loops like this for a year and nothing has happened yet...

The EK radiator isn't the best, but it's still a good radiator for the money, esepcially when the next best thing is £20 more, I can see where you are coming from. It'll do you just fine, you'll probably run a few degrees warmer than if you used a thermochill, but that's nothing really.

From the list you've put in your first post, there are no mixed metals that will cause any problems. Just make sure you run some sort of biocide to prevent anything growing in your loop.

1 metre would probably be fine, depending on your case, but 2m would give you some flexability and room for mistakes. Nothing worse than cutting your last piece of tubing and finding out it's too short, then having to order another metre and pay delivery and wait days to finish the loop off

[mikemikemi]

The EK radiator isn't the best, but it's still a good radiator for the money, esepcially when the next best thing is £20 more, I can see where you are coming from. It'll do you just fine, you'll probably run a few degrees warmer than if you used a thermochill, but that's nothing really.

I agree, difference in price is better than the difference in performance.

Here's a review I found, it's for the 360 but I think it's fair to assume that the results apply equally to the 240.
http://skinneelabs.com/Radiators/EK/CS360/

[Englander]

Thanks for that advice, Peter, very handy! I might as well opt for 2m given how inexpensive tubing is.

So I reckon I'll stick with this rad, then. Does anyone have any comments about the pump and CPU waterblock? Out of interest, would that pump be strong enough to handle a GPU block should I ever feel the need to add one later?

I wouldn't even consider doing anything before early Feb (exams up until then) so I've got plenty of time to finalise a spec, get advice and hunt down the specific components for as cheaply as possible. Speaking of which, is there anything inherently wrong with specialtech.com?

[piggin23]

If you are going to add the GPU latter then the pump you have picked will have problems.
Better to have one of these first
http://www.chilledpc.co.uk/shop/prod...roducts_id=181

This will then give you the ability to add the card without having to payout for another pump.

As for the 7/16" pipe & 1/2" fittings, there will be no leaks but for piece of mind you could add a few of these.

http://www.chilledpc.co.uk/shop/prod...oducts_id=1316

They look very nice in a setup.

But for cost

http://www.chilledpc.co.uk/shop/prod...roducts_id=117

These will do the job.

[Englander]

Thanks Piggin, I've modified the original spec to include the pump and cheap clampy things (might as well at only £2.55 and extra peace of mind).

[mikemikemi]

Thanks for that advice, Peter, very handy! I might as well opt for 2m given how inexpensive tubing is.

So I reckon I'll stick with this rad, then. Does anyone have any comments about the pump and CPU waterblock? Out of interest, would that pump be strong enough to handle a GPU block should I ever feel the need to add one later?

I wouldn't even consider doing anything before early Feb (exams up until then) so I've got plenty of time to finalise a spec, get advice and hunt down the specific components for as cheaply as possible. Speaking of which, is there anything inherently wrong with specialtech.com?

The block's performance is not bad, there are a few blocks out there that perform better, such as the HK 3.0 or Swiftech XT, you could gain 1-3C, this is what I seen in testing on an i7, therefore it may be different on your CPU. However they're in the £55-£60 range. Just depends whether you think it's worth it.

Another thing is that the EK is a restrictive block so a strong pump would be better to get the performance out of the EK.
Edit: Seen your post, you've already changed the pump.

Never bought from specialtech, but have seen them around for ages.

[Englander]

The block's performance is not bad, there are a few blocks out there that perform better, such as the HK 3.0 or Swiftech XT, you could gain 1-3C, this is what I seen in testing on an i7, therefore it may be different on your CPU. However they're in the £55-£60 range. Just depends whether you think it's worth it.

Another thing is that the EK is a restrictive block so a strong pump would be better to get the performance out of the EK.
Edit: Seen your post, you've already changed the pump.

Never bought from specialtech, but have seen them around for ages.

Well I can't really justify an extra £20 for an extra 1-3*C. If I go for the Laing 18W pump, that should be plenty powerful enough to make maximum use of the EK supreme.

[piggin23]

I would spend more money on a better rad and fan combination.
I have used a number of different blocks (D-tek, GTZ, XT) and they all give very similar temps.
The rad and fans will give you better temps when overclocking.

[piggin23]

If you purchase the block you have shown, you will also require one of these

http://www.specialtech.co.uk/spshop/...cat=546&page=1

This will stop the motherboard from distorting when you fit the block.