Should the government put a cap on migrant workers?

[directhex]

I wonder how many people leave uk and heading for Europe and America each year? I am sure it’ll be more than 600000 since 2001.

there are about a million brits in spain alone

[kasavien]

I voted no that i wouldn't want a cap, i don't really have much to add to the argument, i think most of the points that i would have made have already been made. Apart from the points made about our culture and losing it if more people immigrate etc etc

Perhaps you need to travel a bit and widen your horizons. Go and look at the repressive nature of many countrys. Burma, North Korea, Saudi Arabia, Pakistan. Prefer to live there would we?

I would not live in the above countries because of the governments that are in charge, not because of their culture. This country could only get better with regards to its culture, if anyone can point out anything beneficial then please do. Unless the country improves i can easilly see myself emmigrating, i'd like to end up in Canada or New Zealand, the only thing keeping me here is family tbh.

[malfunction]

And I'm saying that we have already reached that point. London Tube bombers and the recent attempted attack on aircraft spring to mind.

There is a saying, "When in Rome do as the Romans do". I do not see why this should only apply to the British and not to other people coming to this country. (And yes it does make me cringe when I see Union Jack English pubs abroad)

Cost us alot, mmn so you think that it is right that people are allowed to incite violence over some cartoons just because it offends them. Tolerate extremist views like the implementaion of Sharia law. Perhaps we should start stoning women for adultry because afterall we should tolerate extremist views.

Nowhere have I said we should "lock out" other cultures. What I do say is that we should determine the number of people allowed to enter and where they come from so as not to get into the mess we are in.

The United States now considers the UK to be it's greatest threat with regards to terorism. This is because of the unprecedented levels of immigration from Muslim countries and the lack of any British government to see the dangers of radical preaching that has been going on for the past 20 years. Our capital has not earned the nickname "Londonistan" for nothing.

Perhaps you need to travel a bit and widen your horizons. Go and look at the repressive nature of many countrys. Burma, North Korea, Saudi Arabia, Pakistan. Prefer to live there would we?

We have some of the earliest documentation on fundamental rights that form the backbone of our society. We have representation, democracy, established law. We have exported these concepts to the rest of the world. We pride ourselves on fair play and the rule of law.

Better a binge drinking, yob culture that is free to choose it's own way than a repressive culture cowering under a government that slaughters it's own people for it's own means.

I think you're confusing caps with vetting who does and doesn't come into the country (and who does and doesn't remain in the country / at liberty within it). I also feel I need to remind you of the nationality of the tube bombers and potential plane bombers.

[iranu]

I think you're confusing caps with vetting who does and doesn't come into the country (and who does and doesn't remain in the country / at liberty within it). I also feel I need to remind you of the nationality of the tube bombers and potential plane bombers.

Those people were "Muslims" first and "British" last. In order for immigration to work the immigrant must accept the culture they are joining and ensure that their British offspring are suitably raised to respect British values even if their own culture has very different views/ways of dealing with issues. The fact that many English Asians support the Pakistani cricket team over the English team speaks volumes. If you are born in Britain (technically) you are British, but if you are raised to be a Pakistani and a Muslim with respect to culture then British is no more than a lable.

Caps and vetting are entwined. Allowing vast numbers of people with a significantly different culture is dangerous. It leads to isolation and ghettos. This is already taking place. (France has the same issue, witness the summer riots) An aggreived, growing minority who have little in common with their adopted country (regardless of whether they are 2nd or 3rd generation), who have little contact with the majority, will always lead more insular lives and have less opportunity than the main stream. This leads to unemployment and other social problems and ultimately a nice little breeding ground for extremism.

Too many people too fast is bad for the immigrants and their families and bad for Britain. You need to integrate people over a much longer period with fewer numbers so that they become established. If the tube bombers had been properly integrated they would have understood how we change policy by changing givernments, not by blowing individual people up on the tube. Not by getting "revenge". If they had been integrated they would not become radicalised even if they had the opportunity in Pakistan.

[kasavien]

Those people were "Muslims" first and "British" last. In order for immigration to work the immigrant must accept the culture they are joining and ensure that their British offspring are suitably raised to respect British values even if their own culture has very different views/ways of dealing with issues. The fact that many English Asians support the Pakistani cricket team over the English team speaks volumes. If you are born in Britain (technically) you are British, but if you are raised to be a Pakistani and a Muslim with respect to culture then British is no more than a lable.

I agree with that to some extent, if you live in a country be respectful to its culture, views, religions etc, eg. in this country respect our freedom of speech and not get worked up over some stupid cartoon etc etc. But also to some extent i have greater respect for the way most muslims live, in that they often don't drink, they have high moral standards etc, so i don't expect them to respect the way some people sleep around and binge drink etc etc (today i are mostly be liking the abreviation etc )

Too many people too fast is bad for the immigrants and their families and bad for Britain. You need to integrate people over a much longer period with fewer numbers so that they become established. If the tube bombers had been properly integrated they would have understood how we change policy by changing givernments, not by blowing individual people up on the tube. Not by getting "revenge". If they had been integrated they would not become radicalised even if they had the opportunity in Pakistan.

One of the reports that i heard said that when other european countries like france are made to open their borders, many of the Polish will go to work there and other european countries as opposed to here. I think then, when less Europeans move to Britain it will be more noticeable, the benefits and difference that they have made to this country. I don't think it will ever be possible to have imigration to a country and just expect the imigrants to adhere fully to that country's views etc. There has to be give and take on both sides.

[badass]

I cant believe a discussion on "Should the government put a cap on migrant workers?" has lasted for so long. A person's hearwear is their choice ,migrant or not

[kasavien]

I cant believe a discussion on "Should the government put a cap on migrant workers?" has lasted for so long. A person's hearwear is their choice ,migrant or not

lol good call

[iranu]

I cant believe a discussion on "Should the government put a cap on migrant workers?" has lasted for so long. A person's hearwear is their choice ,migrant or not

I think you should be allowed to choose your hearware be it ear plugs, ear muffs, dearstalker or ipod earphones.

[HyeongSeong]

Those people were "Muslims" first and "British" last. In order for immigration to work the immigrant must accept the culture they are joining and ensure that their British offspring are suitably raised to respect British values even if their own culture has very different views/ways of dealing with issues. The fact that many English Asians support the Pakistani cricket team over the English team speaks volumes. If you are born in Britain (technically) you are British, but if you are raised to be a Pakistani and a Muslim with respect to culture then British is no more than a lable.

It is actually written in the Quran that the Muslim way of living is more important than the local culture there fore it is impossible for them to change their way of living.

How can they accept our way of living? It’ll be like ask a Christian to become a Muslim when he / she decide to move to the Middle East. I don’t see any problem of people keep their cultures (after all we are all different). The biggest problem that I see at moment is the facts that people are often categorised by work such as British Asian, etc. which really make people feel that they don’t belong here. What is a British Asian any way?

[phoenixmystic]

Multicultuarism is a failed experiment, yes there are many cultures in Britain but they have not come together. I see it everywhere and have experienced it too. there is much deliberate segregation and avoidance and it is not just the whites that are guilty of this as the media would have you belive.
Yes to immigartion limits on the grounds of:-
Immingrants were brought in to replace the aging population with younger models however immigrants also age and thus the things will increase exponentially and get out of control.
Britiains resoures are already stretched it will struggle more and more to maintain the population, the NHS situation is a side effect of this. It has also affected to crime as well. It is sad to hear to nearly every local case of rape that reaches my file box is always a comminted by asylum seeker with Kosovans being the largest slice of that pie.

[directhex]

It is sad to hear to nearly every local case of rape that reaches my file box is always a comminted by asylum seeker with Kosovans being the largest slice of that pie.

well it's a good thing we're talking about polish migrant workers then, and not asylum seekers, isn't it!

[iranu]

It is actually written in the Quran that the Muslim way of living is more important than the local culture there fore it is impossible for them to change their way of living.

How can they accept our way of living? It’ll be like ask a Christian to become a Muslim when he / she decide to move to the Middle East. I don’t see any problem of people keep their cultures (after all we are all different). The biggest problem that I see at moment is the facts that people are often categorised by work such as British Asian, etc. which really make people feel that they don’t belong here. What is a British Asian any way?

You have answered two very important questions.

1. We should not allow large numbers of immigrants from cultures who cannot integrate. The Polish are more than welcome as they share a similar culture and are extremely unlikely to bomb the tube each time they get upset. Some people will see this as rascist - I see it as practical. Would we have this issue if there were no Muslims in the country? The numbers of European migrants should be capped though.

but because we have allowed anyone in we now see No2.

2. This government in particular aswell as it's many hangers on in the finest leftist tradition see the differences in people and shout those differences from the rooftops.

Soon the government will ensure that any company bidding for a government contract will have to meet the criteria or percentage of "ethnic minorities" in their workforce or forgoe the contract.

They just don't get it or see it. If you treat people differently then they are going to feel different and the majority will percieve them as different. The lefties think that they are being "right on" (clench fist in the air) and helping these people, but infact they are doing the exact opposite and helping to foster the divide.

[HyeongSeong]

You have answered two very important questions.

1. We should not allow large numbers of immigrants from cultures who cannot integrate. The Polish are more than welcome as they share a similar culture and are extremely unlikely to bomb the tube each time they get upset. Some people will see this as rascist - I see it as practical. Would we have this issue if there were no Muslims in the country? The numbers of European migrants should be capped though.

but because we have allowed anyone in we now see No2.

2. This government in particular aswell as it's many hangers on in the finest leftist tradition see the differences in people and shout those differences from the rooftops.

Soon the government will ensure that any company bidding for a government contract will have to meet the criteria or percentage of "ethnic minorities" in their workforce or forgoe the contract.

They just don't get it or see it. If you treat people differently then they are going to feel different and the majority will percieve them as different. The lefties think that they are being "right on" (clench fist in the air) and helping these people, but infact they are doing the exact opposite and helping to foster the divide.

People should be treat equal and not be sorted to different groups. for example "british asian" seem to be these people that orig from the sub india country and not what the name suggests. I really hate the fact that it is now used any where inc the news. as far as I concern , there should be only one word to descide us and that is brits .

[directhex]

Would we have this issue if there were no Muslims in the country?

ever heard of the IRA? i could label all irishmen as terrorists if you like, and that wouldn't be racist - it'd be practical!

[kasavien]

ever heard of the IRA? i could label all irishmen as terrorists if you like, and that wouldn't be racist - it'd be practical!

I was going to say something similar, since you got there first i'll second it, you probably said it better than i could anyway

[iranu]

ever heard of the IRA? i could label all irishmen as terrorists if you like, and that wouldn't be racist - it'd be practical!

Once again we see the lax thinking and dreary liberalism that infects those people who cannot think and furthermore try to play the race card to suit their own smug justification. You are wrong and the analogy you quote is misleading (as is most leftist argument)

Let me give you a true analogy, building into it, your example of "Irish" extremism so that you can compare the two and learn your folly.

Let's say for example you own a house and have a family consisting of your lovely wife and two twin boys. The twin boys squabble and fight alot. You have tried and tried to stop them bickering but they just won't have it. One of the twins' friends seems to stir him up alot and encourages him to be more violent towards his brother. His brother retaliates and a "tit for tat" exchange is the result. This leads to damage around the house and a general bad atmosphere. Sometimes one of the two go's too far and other people in the street are involved.

At this point you decide to take in another child but you have to take his brother too as part of the deal. You adopt them because you think it would be a good idea or you are feeling guilty for past wrongs (whatever they might be). An extra pair of hands or two to help around the house, a bit of a change, some diversity, it might be fun. As the years go on one of the adopted children becomes more and more isolated and starts to demand more and more rights that are alien to you and your family who do not agree with them. The other just gets on with it.

The twins are just as bad and one of them has smashed the place up 2 or 3 times, but you are trying to ensure that the friend who "eggs" one of them on comes around less often, has less influence and that there are good means to control both unruly twins. The adopted child continues to cause a bit of trouble, but only in small amounts and you believe you can handle this, afterall you have his brother to keep a eye on him.

Then one day one of the adopted children does as much damage to the house as one of the unruly twins and has clearly overstepped the mark and there is a large potential that the friends he has made will come to his aid and do the same only on a grander scale. His brother is appalled and dislikes it.

What do you do? Would you chuck one of your own sons, the twin out who has wrecked the house a few times? Would you chuck out his brother because he has continually retaliated? Would you ask the adopted child to leave and wish you had never invited them? Would you ask for another adopted child with the same background as the first one? Would you continue to allow the adopted child to have radicalising friends around for tea or allow him to visit his mates for tea and a quick lesson on how to use an AK-47? Would you bury your head and hope it all goes away? You are stuck with the dilemma originating from your original choice of allowing someone else (good or bad) into your home.

Substitute IRA and the UVF for the twins. Substitute the growing Islamo-fascists for the adopted child. Substitute the honest immigrant for the adopted sibling. Substitute the Britsh (government) for the beleagered parent. Substitute the Irish republic (in general as "one of the friend" - sympathiser)

You cannot ban family from the family home in the same way that you cannot ban the Irish from Northern Ireland.

The Northern Irish are British and as such have full rights, unless a situation occurs where the government decides that it is for the greater good for a small minority to forgoe those rights - (I disagree with this by the way). The Irish problem is an internal one and as such is not driven by much outside influence (thinking USA here, oh the irony).

However, Islamic fundamentalism is most certainly alien to the British Isles in that before large scale immigration it was unknown. Successive governments have turned a blind eye to the radical extremism based in London and its spread amongst second and third generation Muslims. If British governments had banned (in reality reduced) those that wish to come here from such cultures that have the greatest potential to disrupt our way of life and influence individuals to destroy the country that they have been born into then we would not be facing this threat. There would not be this mistrust if the rate of immigrants from very diverse cultures had been slowed so that proper integration could take place.

As soon as you allow uncontrolled immigration that leads to a nucleus of people who do not have any connection with, or as much opportunity as the indiginous population, then you are asking for trouble. We had the Broadwater farm riots and years later we had the Bradford riots. Somehow our political masters do not learn because they are too afraid of the racist tag.

We and other European countries need to sort this out and sort it fast. It does not mean gas chambers and ethnic cleansing. It does not mean civil war. The requirement is to shrug off all bogus claims of racism and deal with the problem upfront, publicly and in an honest way. We ned to clamp down hard on any extremism and any group no matter how much the left thinks it's "cool" or "right-on" to support these people in the name of diversity, multi-culturism and any other tosh branded about. I'm thinking Danish cartoons here.

As a footnote, the increase in Eastern European immigration as such, will not tramsmute into a "backlash" in the same way that Islamic immigration has not resulted in a "backlash". It is only when indiginous populations feel truly threatened will this backlash occur and no politition or do-gooder or lefty liberal can give you an accurate gauge until it is too late.

Much better to be cautious and take things steadily than rush to a "paradise of mutliculturism" that leads to the exact opposite.