Vauxhall moan + Astra MK4 Exhaust manifold...

[Gr44]

Righto....

I'm _not_ going to tell you the entire story of this rather large hatred I currently have of Vauxhall. Because, frankly - it would probably see me through to some un-earthly hour. Make no sense, because I'd be way to annoyed and possibly fill up all the server hard drives.

So, the latest installment - with minor background... is below:

Brought an Astra SRi 2.0 MK4 in Feb last year. Now, the car has been great, to be fair. I've really enjoyed driving it - for what it is, it goes fairly quick and handles surprisingly well.

Had a few minor issues when I got it - which took Vauxhall MONTHS to finally fix - which, left a rather bitter taste in my mouth. After weeks of trying to labour this point to them, managed to get a free service. ( which didnt turn out as fantastic as promised anyway ).

Anyway.

I noticed a strange noise from my car late last year and stupidly, I took it to vauxhalls around mid-late Jan. Second, my downfall was to take it to the same actual garage - bad idea.

They have a look at it - an entire day. I don't get a phone call ( obviously ). Let me hasten to add the fact I work ~20 miles from said garage, they shut before I finish work so if it IS ready I do really need to know, so I can leave early - pointed this out, several times.

However, phone them up about 3:30pm - they'ed looked at it. Nothing wrong with it. Tip top shape.

Result. Right? Wrong.

Now, this noise which is 'normal' apprently. starts annoying me again a few weeks later.... I did my best to put up with it, but even my friends were asking if something was up with the car.

So, phoned up and asked them to re-check it.. got it booked in about mid-late march ( early april?! ) My warrenty ran out a few weeks before this second check up. It was still valid on the first, though.

Low and behold, after the usual hassle of not getting phoned and god knows what, they find out that:

'Basically, one of the Exhaust Manifold bolts have snapped off. This is causing the noise due to exhaust emissions escaping between the block and the manifold. It's a minimum 2 and a half hours labour to take the manifold off and take a look - however we may need to strip down the entire engine incase the bolt has fallen inside the block - once this is done we would need to re-tap the exhaust manifold'

Okay, now - I don't know alot about cars. But, surely HAD the bold fallen INSIDE the engine... one of the many moving parts would have HIT the bloody thing by now?

Anyway, I swallowed this because, as said - I don't know enough about cars to argue.

This is where it gets REALLY interesting.

Today ( month + later ) I got around to taking it to a place near work. Left it with them, see if I could get a quote - I told him that the manifold bolt needed re-tapping but he insisting on taking the heat shield off and looking himself.

He phones up a couple of hours later and says:

'Hi Sean, yup unfourtunatley the Exhaust manifold its self has actually cracked so you'd need to get a new one in there'
I was a little concerned he might be trying to flease me, he must have sense my concern in my voice as he said I was welcome to pop over and take a look as the heat shield was still off.

So, I went over when I got a free minute... fair enough, a very long hairline crack down the middle of the thing... Bugger!!! What, I found most interesting though... not ONE of the manifold bolts was broken.

Er? Vauxhall ? I wouldnt argue that the exhaust manifold _may_ have cracked since the bolt had broken.
But, the bolt sure as hell wouldn't have repaired its self!

I have two reasons for posting this anyway. I know there is some one on this forum who works for Vauxhall HQ ( or used to ) as I recall him helping another member. If you're there - I would love to speak with you!!

Secondly, I know alot of people are very knowledgable about cars on here. What sort of price should I be looking at to get this work done? ( assuming I can't blag a free one. Doubt it )

The garage near my work quoted £280 including manifold/gasket/new bolts, labour and VAT.

Thanks for reading and for any help!

[Zak33]

Some dealers have less scruples than others, but mainly it's down to dim mechanics or dim front desk staff not getting the right diagnosis. But that's not a Vauxhall issue...thats a Motor Trade issue. Find a good dealer...stick with them.

Second, a new manifold would be worth getting through a scrap yard as lots of those cars have been smacked up and scrapped.

Thirdly: A private job on that car, IF you get the manifold yourself, should cost no more than £60 in labour but will need manifold gaskets, and maybe new bolts.

Third: If you have the Estimate for the snapped bolt, proving they diagnosed it, and now have independant proof that it isn't snapped... write to the dealer, with photo copies of documents, asking how such a mistake could occur, and CC Vauxhall Customer Care in Luton to the letter.

It's a shame really. Something like this ruins people's belief in good cars.

[Zak33]

oh....you need to see/hear it running to MAKE SURE that crack is the noise. It might not go through to the exhausy gas....though thats unlikely.

[SilentDeath]

sounds fun I hate ford franchises possibly just as much. Ive had to visit them about 20 times since I started my engine rebuild since they keep giving me the wrong parts and one broken one. Took over 1 1/2 hours to find one gasket... Btw tht includes having the part number from the old gasket, then bringing in the old one for them to see..

Never goto a dealer for anything, other than warranty/services when new.....
I find it hard to trust most mechanics, but I refuse to trust those that work so close to salesmen/marketing people/receptionists


Try having a look on one of the vaux/astra owners forums. I dont know how old mk4 model is but theres probably plenty of people breaking them.

Also many parts sites like findapart.co.uk might help but never used them...


Its strange that it cracked though. My guess is that they noticed it when you had it serviced, so they tightened it up, then noise stopped untill the manifold cracked...

Would be interested to know what the other problems were?

[Gr44]

Some dealers have less scruples than others, but mainly it's down to dim mechanics or dim front desk staff not getting the right diagnosis. But that's not a Vauxhall issue...thats a Motor Trade issue. Find a good dealer...stick with them.

God, if and when I find one mate - I'll pay them a full time wage just so they never leave!

Second, a new manifold would be worth getting through a scrap yard as lots of those cars have been smacked up and scrapped.

Roger, shall look out chap cheers! Assume they don't reallysugger from too much wear and tear as they're just a huge lump of metal!

Thirdly: A private job on that car, IF you get the manifold yourself, should cost no more than £60 in labour but will need manifold gaskets, and maybe new bolts.

So the guys at the garage I tried today are pretty much trying to shaft me then?

Third: If you have the Estimate for the snapped bolt, proving they diagnosed it, and now have independant proof that it isn't snapped... write to the dealer, with photo copies of documents, asking how such a mistake could occur, and CC Vauxhall Customer Care in Luton to the letter.

Going to try and dig this out tomorrow. I didn't get an estimate but did request a cover note with the problem written on it at the time. I will certainly have a moan at them... how far it gets me though - they're so despondant in that garage it's unreal. The lot of them need to go on a customer service course, honestly - I've seen more friendly Lions in un-fed captivity. ( I frequent the zoo with anti-feed policies - and why not?! )

Thanks Zak!

SilentDeath -

Franchies really do suck. I only went there because of the year warrenty - else I sure as hell wouldn't atleast not after the first time!

MK4's are the _really_ common astras you see mate. From around 98' - 04 I think. model before the newest ones. Certainly plently of parts going, the 2.0 Petrol was, however the rarest model of them all as it was discontinued quite early on and replaced with a 2.2 and a 2.0T. ( dont know if they have the same manifolds though )

You might be right, god knows. I'll never know or be able to prove what they did/didn't do and to be honest, I'm not sure if I want to know. I'm tempted to stand behind the mechanic everytime I have work done on my car to be honest - if nothing else but to laugh at how incompetent they are.

I already record how miles it has when I leave my keys with a garage - and take a photo on my phone - HOW PARANOID?

2 'main' problems when I got the car.

1) On my test drive I pointed out that the airbag light was on the dash.

When I picked it up it was still on. wasn't insured for my old car any more though so I obviously had to take it.

Turned out, the airbag light was due to some connector in the passenger seat. When they fixed this, a week later I noticed the passenger seat was warped ( wonder how that happened?! ) wasn't sat on the rails right.

After this, the airbag light came on when they tried to fix the seat, seat broke when they tried to do the airbag. Told me both were fixed several times when neither were. Seat was clearly still shagged when I picked it up but they tried to exclaim it was fine!

Anyway, I can't remember exact days - in total they had it over 40 days though! On and off... few days here, few days there.

Idiots.

[ExceededGoku]

My Corsa 1.0l moans... it's more like a whine really. Sort of holds onto revs for too long. Can't wait to get rid of it, such a piece of s**t (it's only 2 years old and 25k miles...). Next car is going to be a 3dr Focus 2.0 Zetec Climate (new shape)

[Zak33]

My Corsa 1.0l moans... it's more like a whine really. Sort of holds onto revs for too long.

thats cos its a 3 cylinder and has a flywheel the size of Iceland to make it smooth at high revs and to keep fuel consumption very good.

Nothing wrong with that.. its how they all are. 3 cylinders make a funny noise and hold their revs. Without it, long motorway hills would be impossible.

I like 1.0 3cylinder Corsa's....they teach you to plan ahead

[kalniel]

Can I ask which vaux dealer you used? - so I know to avoid them! The MasterFit one I use has been great so far.

[99Flake]

I know how you feel mate, sounds like you have had a near identical experience to mine.

I bought a '97 1.6 Zetec Escort from what was called Pipers Vauxhall in Tunbridge Wells. Now obviously I got the years Network Q warranty with this car, which is great.

6 months after owning the car I am driving along and the car decides to blow all the power steering fluid out.

I take the car to the dealer and they say that it is the rack that needs replacing, as the bolt that goes into it with the hose had ripped out taking all the thread in the rack with it. They say it will take 3 days to repair as they need the part from Ford. I said fine but I need it by the Saturday (that was just over a week away) as I was off to Alton Towers with my gf and she was staying at my uni for a week.

3 days are up, no calls, nothing. I phone them and they say they are still waiting on the part, should be with them today so I should call tomorrow. This goes on and on and it is Saturday. I call them 1st thing and they say 'no sorry car is still not ready' I ask for a courtesey car as I needed to get to uni and had told them this at pains. After over an hour of me actually shouting at the service manager I finally get a 1.0l Corsa (not fun to take 2.5 hours up the Mway).

Anway I called the garage whilst I am at uni and they say it is ready, so I go down next weekend and collect, take it to Ford who look at it and say there is no new rack but it had just been heli-coiled.

I mean what the ****? All that grief for nothing.

And muggins here then took it for a service (thought it best as it was still under warranty). They phone saying that the n/s/r brake and fog lights don't work but it must be the cluster as it isn't the bulbs. I put the phone down and thought for a minute and it occured to me that Mk 6 Escorts don't have a n/s/r fog light. They were also supposed to fix an the dash light. In fact none of the dash worked any more except the speedo.

I took it to an auto electricians and it was......wait for it: A new break light bulb and two new fuses.

Then it got better as a couple of months later a knocking noise appeared (2 weeks before the end of the warranty) I take it in and they phone back saying that they can't find a fault. So I collect it take it home and it starts knocking again. This went on for about 10 days until the drive shaft snapped. I took it in 1 day out of warranty by this point and they said they wouldn't pay for the work.

I asked to speak to the manager and I got him to bring my files up on the computer and he agreed that my experience with the place had been a disaster and phoned Network Q to say they were doing it under goodwill and I would get a free service.

He was a new guy and was very helpful, a few weeks later the dealership changed to a Caffyns and all seems better now from what I hear. Personally I refuse to step in the place or any other Vauxhall dealer.

[Zak33]

god howe I wish I could sort this kinda thing.

The motor trade IS uber better now, but weirdly the service depts (on the whole) are the slowest to improve (in my opinion)

there are exceptions, some absolultely top class workshops and service managers...but lots are not great.

I know it sounds corny, but the only departments that have upped their game in the last 10 years....are Sales Depts. Because the profit margins have shrunk, competition has got fierce, and the best Sales men survive.

But Service dept's are still often booked 4 or 5 days in advance, charging £70-100 / hour, and can irritate many many customers as there's a steady flow.

And dont think it's just mainstream dealers, like Ford who treat people badly.

I know BMW and Merc dealers who are a disaster. But I tell you waht guys.....if you worked in some of those dealers, for 6 months, ...YOU'd stop giving a rat's ass too. It's not a pretty site, the motor trade at the moment.

Bloody good value second hand cars though

[Howard]

My car's at Honda at the moment... shall post later how smoothly smooth it went (or not!)

[Gr44]

Kalniel,

I 'used' loose term, the Vauxhall dealer in Luton - the one closest to junction 11 of the M1 ( right next to PC world ).
It's an 'Evans Halshaw' franchise one... I also have bad experiances of 2 other Evans Halshaws as well, but thats another story!! Those were in St. Albans ( Ashley Rd ) and Harpenden ( High St. )

99Flake,

I'm glad I'm not the only one mate, I have to say there do seem to be some similar aspects to our stories!!
Really does make you wonder when they don't happen to find anything wrong so near to the end of the warrenty doesn't it.... warrentys are more trouble than they are worth I think!!

Zak33,

No kidding mate... It's this kind of thing that makes me more tempted to buy the cheapest P.O.S I can find and run them into the ground every few months to be honest.

Even if you do spend an arm and a leg ( relative, obviously ) for a nice new car you always seem to get _something_ wrong with it. Buying and maintaining a car has NEVER been a smooth experiance - part of the reason why the motor trade is in such a bad state if you ask me. Rightly so too, most other industries look after their customers - if not atleast they _try_ and fob you off and make you feel good about it, as far as I'm concerned the motor industry just plain doesn't care.

Look forward to reading your story Howard!

By the way, does anyone know if the 2.0 Litre ( non turbo ) petrol ( XE20XEV, I think? ) has an exhaust manifold the same as any other engine size? ( make it easier to find a 2nd hand part as the 20XEV was quite rare )

Oh by the way, small update on this.

Been quoted £280 and £220 so far ( for new bits, not got round to finding some 2nd hand parts yet )

I phoned up Evans Halshaw on Monday and not ONE manager was available. The service manager was on leave for the rest of the week and the store manager who was covering was unable to speak to me because... he was on 'DND'. She left a message with him to call me back.

He didn't, obviously.

Phoned up today, spoke to another receptionist who wasn't a complete stuck-up <enter rude word> - she said that the service manager ( doug ) WAS around... ?! He just had Monday off. He was unable to speak as he was in a meeting and she left me a message.

Some other women from the place phoned me up saying she was dealing with Dougs work for the day as he was in 'Meetings all day' What the _hell_ do they have meetings all day about anyway?!

She was reasonably friendly... I briefly told her my story.

She said on the record is shows that the exhaust manifold SAID it was cracked and that a bolt was also missing?!

Which was complete BS - atleast I never got this information anyway, infact the guy at servicing said: ' As it's only one bolt I wouldn't worry about it as there won't be much exhaust leaking from it anyway '

Slightly differant than 'Theres a giant great big gash in your exhaust manifold '.

I told her ( put slightly more nicely ) that I basically thought they were fully aware of the problem when I put the car in the first time and the lack of communication and in-ability to give me the correct information the second time only improves this theory. I played with the posibility that a new manifold would keep me quiet to which she said she would have to speak to Doug.

Who will in theory, phone me tomorrow....

Watch this space!

[Howard]

Look forward to reading your story Howard!

Sorry it's not very long-winded or interesting I'm afraid Took it in this morning to have the cambelt changed and an oil change/simple service, and it was done by about 2PM, efficient service, friendly staff (this is a main Honda franchise dealer btw), they even gave me some wire and cable ties so I could tie my mum's car back together outside the dealer "Hello, I've come to collect my car, but can I have some string to fix my mum's car first?"

[kalniel]

Kalniel,

I 'used' loose term, the Vauxhall dealer in Luton - the one closest to junction 11 of the M1 ( right next to PC world ).
It's an 'Evans Halshaw' franchise one... I also have bad experiances of 2 other Evans Halshaws as well, but thats another story!! Those were in St. Albans ( Ashley Rd ) and Harpenden ( High St. )

Thanks for that - especially about Evans as they're not far from where I work in Harpenden and I've been tempted to look at them before.

The one I can recommend is in Findern, Derby.

[Zak33]

Howard....Honda dealers tend to be more friendly..cos the customers cars dont break...so the customers are more friendly, so the staff are less stressed. Plus Honda Tech Centre can always help them if they need it, which aint the case for most main franchises. So lifem in short, is less stressfull at a Hinda dealer.

I know that sounds silly...but it's not.

Honda's are superior. I just dont own one!

[Gr44]

Howard you bugger! *buys Honda Accord*

Kalniel, Derby is a bit of a way to go!!! Now the warrenty is out I'll just use a garage near my work in St. Albans. Can't be any more hassle than the vauxhall monkeys.

Update:

I *did* get called back today ( shock horror ) by the same lass who took Dougs messages yesterday. She was fairly friendly, I guess.

They want to look at my car and they will *come to an arrangment about the price* apprently.... Despite the fact I told them exactley what it needs ( 1xmanifold 2x gaskets and a new bolts! ) they insisted on seeing it again. So that's a morning off work and a 20 mile detour - fantastic!

Oh well.... wait until next Tuesday and I'll let you know the next thing they mess up!