Scientology

[Dareos]

http://forums.hexus.net/showthread.php?t=107632&page=6


Bandwagon = mine, gerroff!


wanna be my high priest?

[autopilot]

This has been mentioned before, the exact transliteration of the Bible denotes the creation of the earth as six periods of time as opposed to the earth being created in six days.

[edit: sorry to nit-pick, I know I'm annoying ]

To me though, statements like that just epitomise why the bible can't be a credible source of factual information, and why i can't believe anything that comes out of a religious persons mouth when it comes to debating their religion. People take whatever meaning suits them at the time. It's all far to convenient and just add's more weight to the argument that it's absolute nonsense. Instead of a good bit of reasoning or fact, it's like "oh, no it's just the way you read it...". It's like talking to a bloody cars salesman (not aimed at you Kezzer mate).

Anyway, when i was a kid the Vicar at the Church i went to said 6 days, so what's the real difference if that what the religious leaders spout?

[autopilot]

so where do druids fit in with all this?

Oh, they all left for Mars ages ago.



Look at the platform they launch shuttles from at the Kennedy Space Station, and now look at Stone Henge. No coincidence there. And the stones got knocked down by the burners. Ah, see! the pennies dropping now eh...

[Dareos]

wouldnt it be completely cool if we found stone circles (ala stonehenge) on mars

[Stoo]

Oh, they all left for Mars ages ago.

I hope they're not vegetarians then

[Kezzer]

To me though, statements like that just epitomise why the bible can't be a credible source of factual information, and why i can't believe anything that comes out of a religious persons mouth when it comes to debating their religion. People take whatever meaning suits them at the time. It's all far to convenient and just add's more weight to the argument that it's absolute nonsense. Instead of a good bit of reasoning or fact, it's like "oh, no it's just the way you read it...". It's like talking to a bloody cars salesman (not aimed at you Kezzer mate).

Anyway, when i was a kid the Vicar at the Church i went to said 6 days, so what's the real difference if that what the religious leaders spout?

No that's understandable, I read a lot of literature about the Bible. There are lots of inconsistencies, and the translations are difficult to grasp sometimes. It's not about the 6 days though, and Christians shouldn't concentrate on things like this. Atheists tend to concentrate on these tiny little things and make it out like the bible is completely wrong based on these facts. We're aware of these issues, seriously. I bet I know more contradictions in the bible than most atheists do, yet people ask me why I still follow it?

The bible isn't the words of God, it's just emphasised as the Word of God because it contains the Word of God (to us Christians). If it were the word of God then why did men write it?

Also, just because someone is a Vicar, it doesn't automatically give them the credibility to be right. They're just men who follow God, and a lot of the time their old doctrine seems to lead them to immoral acts such as child abuse. Don't get me wrong, they're not all like that, but c'mon, let's look at the headlines here, it's happened on so many occasions

[Nick]

Ok, so just to put the Bible under a critical spotlight for a minute, let's say the Bible is a scientific paper produced to prove something.

Now, given the masses of inconsistencies, would anyone take the Bible as anything other than contradictory and unprovable if it was published today?

Of course not.

Just because something is old, it doesn't mean it is right.

And on the subject of misinterpretation and mistranslation surely the people who push the Bible as being true and a basis for a religion have a duty to ensure it's correct? That their interpretation is correct?

Hang on, we've had that already with the schisms in the C of E, Methodists et al.

But sadly, the damn Scientologists have utterly undermined my argument as their book, which is completely unprovable, has been accepted as fact by millions...

Damn, if only I could be as convincing, I'd have sold every bridge and landmark in London twice over by now.

[[GSV]Trig]

Actually, for those of us who don't believe the bible is an accurate and impartial history of the world, historical evidence strongly suggests Jesus never existed.

That's just part of the similarity between Christianity and Scientology.

Apart from the fact we know that Scientology was started by a Sci-Fi writter, afaik we dont know who actually wrote the Bible..
And lets be fair, chances are it wasnt originally written in English so theres room for error there.
Also look at the bit where the new leader of the scientologists now rubbishes the aliens in volcanoes thing, its also possible that some unbelivable parts of the bible have also been removed over time to make it sound more believable, imagine what the book of scientology might look like after a few thousand years of revisions.

[ikonia]

The TV show last night was very very interesting and enjoyable.

A few things (apart from the obvious) worked my brain a little.

1.) How can a majority educated populated be blind
2.) Is this a western Islam ?
I'll clarify that,

I've had a problem with the muslim teachings in that there rule somewhere that states along the lines of "If you are not a muslim - you don't deserve to live" which is basiclly a religious right to kill. or to paraphrase - none believers should be killed

The teachings last night of "fair game" attacks seem to be the western version of that, and there is none-factual evidence on the net scientology has gone as far as murder, but thats just speculation.
3.) how can the behaviour filmed and documented on tv not be under investigation by authorities, eg: harrasment, following people, etc etc.

It was quite worring how the writings of a science fiction writer now holds both a.) celibirty status and b.) policial power.

[[GSV]Trig]

I was pointed in the direction of this youtube video yesterday.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hxqR5NPhtLI

Since yesterday the video has changed from the BBC's camera view to the Scientology camera view..

I also posted this comment on the video

So let me get this right, Scientology is some sort of pyramid scheme then?
How many religions dont want everyone to know about there "God", let alone charging people to learn about them?

Needless to say the comment wasnt published as they all need to be approved buy the video poster, who, as you may of guessed is a Scientologist...
Also if you check all the comments none of them attack or badmouth Scientology in anyway, they all attack the BBC or the reporter or are random wtf/lol type comments...
So then sent this message to the video poster..

One thing that sticks in my mind about the BBC Report, they said that the Scientologists cannot take any form of critisim, all of the "approved" comments to your video support that comment, they all slate the BBC or are random comments, NOTHING questions Scientology, check the profile of the video poster, guess what, a scientologist...
Your faith cannot stand any critism in any form, that to me is a rather blinkered way to live your life, if it works for you fine but surely other people have the same freedom of speech that the leader (sorry forgot his name) mentions in the BBC report.
I look forward to the otherside of that report but so far the BBC's side seems more substantial from the simple point of view that there are no negative comments allowed about scientology, and your video reflects that.

No reply as of yet, and, not really expecting one tbh...

[[GSV]Trig]

Holy crop circles batman...

Thanks for your message.

Please see http://www.uptone.co.uk

Regards,

John

I am now replying and checking out his website...

[mcmiller]

i think whats more worrying is that ppl who to a certain degree are looked up to and a have a huge platform to spout this crap ala tom cruise, john travolta especially after that crappy film he made that was based on the book

[Kezzer]

afaik we dont know who actually wrote the Bible..
And lets be fair, chances are it wasnt originally written in English so theres room for error there.

Well we do in most cases, look at the gospels

No, it wasn't originally written in English, in fact, none of it was, hence why there are so many translations. I study different translations and how passages from the bible can differ causing a huge difference in meaning. This is why Christians can be misled into thinking that the bible is utterly correct in every way. Just last night I was told that every gospel is correct in terms of Jesus' resurrection, which is contradictory because in one gospel there was a man present then two women turned up, in another there were two angels, in another there was one angel, and in another it was two men. Which one is correct?

Anyway Scientology, nuts! And yes, it is scary that the guy who created it is a crazy sci-fi fanatic.

[pollaxe]

Definitely an interesting program.. the 'church' came across as being very sinister with a lot of worryingly influential people in it and a clear agenda of control. Then again, I feel similarly about a lot of other institutions (Catholic Church etc.)

As [GSV]Trig raises, time lends any faith/religion some kind of veneer of acceptability/establishment. My own view is the further we can keep religion from any form of government the better. I also agree with Ikonia's point about the inherent problem of people believing their own religion is 'better' than that of others, especially if it enshrines the 'right' to retaliate against/attack the 'infidel.'

My own religious beliefs are few, I have a vague belief in something 'hereafter' but I certainly wouldn't put money on it. If you're going to examine any religion closely then the evidence for all of them is comparatively poor, that's why we have 'faith' I suppose. Personally, I'm glad to be agnostic.

[pollaxe]

Anyway Scientology, nuts! And yes, it is scary that the guy who created it is a crazy sci-fi fanatic.

And someone who wrote very, very, very bad sci-fi to boot!

[[GSV]Trig]

I have just replied to John's message, we will see from there if he replies further if his original reply wasnt just a copy and past to the no doubt numerous messages hes had lately..

John,

Firstly thanks for your reply, I must admit I wasn’t actually expecting one having seen the selective approval of comments to the video.
While I have no immediate wish to become a Scientologist I am rather intrigued after what I saw on Panorama last night and have decided to look into what seems to be a rather popular topic of the moment, and as they say, truth is a three edged sword..
I will watch the panorama exposed video and then, if it’s ok by you, and you have the time ask a few questions which arise from there.

Thanks for your time.