Anyone Know When The Next Gen Nvidia Cards Are Being Released

[CAT-THE-FIFTH]

OTH,Intel is not above using very dodgy practices either. I am not sure whether in practice it would be a good idea. Its a shame that S3 Graphics only does IGPs now.

Another thing is,that profit margins in the consumer market are not that high either and is the main reason both companies are improving compute performance at the expense of gaming performance in most games. They want to break into more profitable markets with their GPUs.

[Phage]

OTH,Intel is not above using very dodgy practices either.

Should fit right in then.

I am not sure whether in practice it would be a good idea.

Why ? Too big a competitor ?

Another thing is,that profit margins in the consumer market are not that high either and is the main reason both companies are improving compute performance at the expense of gaming performance in most games.

Sure, but anything they can do, Intel can can do at least as well. In fact wasn't their GPU originally aimed as a compute card ?

[Terbinator]

Sure, but anything they can do, Intel can can do at least as well. In fact wasn't their GPU originally aimed as a compute card ?

I think it was more of a salvage job.

[Phage]

Salvaging a compute card from their GPU means that their architecture was similar to that of the GCN/Fermi.

I can't see why anyone would be against Intel introducing more competition ? Unless you think that they're so large that they'll distort the market any more than it already is ?

[CAT-THE-FIFTH]

Should fit right in then.



Why ? Too big a competitor ?

Missed the whole shenanigans when AMD had the Athlon 64?? Pay companies bribes essentially to limit the competition entering important OEM sales. Then look at what they did to Nvidia with chipsets.

At least AMD and Nvidia keep their tactics to software and at least,AFAIK,compete fairly with each other when it comes to hardware.

Intel should keep to improving its IGPs IMHO. That will be where they can make a valuable contribution by raising the bar of basic graphics.

Sure, but anything they can do, Intel can can do at least as well. In fact wasn't their GPU originally aimed as a compute card ?

Knights Corner is 100% compute and is based on X86 cores. Larrabee was also based on X86 cores.

[Terbinator]

Yeah Knights Corner is (was?) just a load of general cores rather than something specifically compute such as Stream(GCN?) and CUDA.

[Phage]

At least AMD and Nvidia keep their tactics to software and at least AFAIK,compete fairly with each other when it comes to hardware..

I don't see any difference between underhanded tactics in software or hardware. Just as bad as each other.

Intel should keep to improving its IGPs IMHO. That will be where they can make a valuable contribution by raising the bar of basic graphics...

Agreed. The halo effect will serve us all well.

[CAT-THE-FIFTH]

I don't see any difference between underhanded tactics in software or hardware. Just as bad as each other.

No it isn't. What Intel does is worse by any stretch of the imagination. They were literally stopping competitors from putting hardware into OEM machines. OEM sales are the bread and butter sales of companies like AMD and Nvidia. They are the bottom line. Intel screwed over BOTH AMD and Nvidia significantly in this regard.

[Phage]

Whereas you can buy an ATi card, it just won't work with 'our' games. Not much in it tbh.
I'm not holding up Intel as a good/better company, but allowing that all companies are amoral, and that more competition is a good thing....

[watercooled]

Replying to posts over the last few pages here so forgive the layout of this post.

I quite like TechPowerUp myself, they give plenty of games, each with different settings and do loads of power measurements AT THE CARD not just measuring whole system performance with different test systems like some do.

I do like how Anandtech talk in depth about the architecture of the different cards but there's no way I'd rely purely on their results now, some results seem to magically change between tests, without any explanation why, and they often avoid certain tests which would allow a platform to perform much more competitively. That, and their power use measurements are often near useless as they're either whole system with too many variables or worse, they measure only 12v power for CPU which is only a part of the consumption of i3/5/7 Intel CPUs. They also forget to mention what the power measurement is for, as was pointed out here with the IVB review.

I may be repeating myself (sorry if I am) but I think the 7970 is definitely frontend-limited, it seems to have tons of shader power as demonstrated by the scaling vs 680 at higher resolutions whereas the 7870 is a more balanced gaming platform for 'normal' resolutions.

Intel did try their hand at GPU with Larrabee, but they couldn't compete with AMD/Nvidia with gaming performance. They aimed for current GPU performance, but by the time they'd managed that, the others were like 2/3 generations ahead. If they were 'too big a competitor' or 'if anyone can do it...' they would have succeeded surely? There's a massive difference between CPU and GPU design, Intel was trying to design a many-core x86 platform which may have been somewhat easier to program in certain scenarios but at the cost of poor efficiency (partly because of lots of overhead vs GPUs). Intel would dearly love to get into the discrete GPU market, and competition probably would have been a good thing* but alas they failed and tried to salvage what they could with Knight's Ferry.
*But as mentioned, only if they played fair. Based on their history, maybe it's a good thing they didn't...

[CAT-THE-FIFTH]

Whereas you can buy an ATi card, it just won't work with 'our' games. Not much in it tbh.
I'm not holding up Intel as a good/better company, but allowing that all companies are amoral, and that more competition is a good thing....

It is the mass sales which are the rock of many companies finanicials and it is also the main reason that discrete cards are more and more compute orientated,ie,so that development costs can be shared between markets. Consumer DIY sales are much more peaky from what I gather especially from an investors point of view. Dell was paid a metric **** ton of money so they would actively limit the number of AMD machines in their lineups for years. Nvidia was pushed out of the chipset business when Intel massively jacked up the cost of the licenses. Plus the X86 and fab connection was another one which was fantastic. That is just the hardware side,and neither AMD or Nvidia can do that so this is why they play software games with each other. Then add the Intel fab advantage(the legitimate one) and I just see where the battle will go.

That is also assuming,that Intel won't do the same thing on the software side either(some people say they already do this with CPUs,but I don't know if this is true),if they were actively entering the gaming market. They would do both IMHO and all I could see is both Nvidia and AMD being marginalised in the long run,just like with S3 Graphics. Then you will be left with companies like Qualcomm and the like who would only be interested in mass market commodity devices anyway. I would rather prefer the current situation than Intel being basically a monopoly,with AMD and Nvidia around just to give a resemblance of competition in the discrete gaming card market.

[Djini]

Deleted

[DanceswithUnix]

People seem to be forgetting that Intel entered the graphics market some years ago with the i740. They took a beating and retreated.

Sounds like their Larrabee effort was never going to fly for graphics as the data wouldn't flow through it well enough (from interview comments from ATI & Nvidia at the time).

If Huawei can plug the IP together to make a decently performing tablet/phone chip, then frankly I suspect the Chinese are a better bet for a future graphics competitor than Intel will ever be. They have the resources, and the inclination.

Edit to add: This is what I was thinking of with the Huawei reference.
http://www.brightsideofnews.com/news...n-in-dust.aspx

[Terbinator]

NDA lift tonight/early morning?

[CAT-THE-FIFTH]

OcUK have a GTX580 on special offer for around £288!

[Phage]

I think it's midnight tonight ?