Since when did Paypal become an escrow service?

[Flash477]

It sounds to me that Ebay/Paypal just wants an easy way to earn some extra interest on our cash!

[SingingOrange]

I wish there were good competition for ebay \ paypal.

[Zak33]

I'm mildly annoyed. The (Edit: Auzentech X-Fi) Prelude I was selling went as buy it now on ebay. Paypal have sent me a message that they are witholding funds until I receive positive feedback from the buyer or 21 days passes with no dispute being filed. They want me to post the thing now. I logged into my Paypal account, thinking I smelled a rat, but it looks like it's genuine.

me too.. typical of them really.
Unless I get positive, I have to wait 21 days to get my dough. Happened to my missus too.. they're alegedly protecting the buyer incase we're pulling a fast one.

[Flash477]

It's always the same - the things that they do to stop the theives (or in video games, pirates) always hurts the legitimate users most

[Saracen]

The problem is .... both sides of a transaction can be rip-off artists.

If you buy something and pay for it, and what arrives isn't what you paid for (or it never arrives at all), it can be a nightmare getting the money back if the con merchant already has his greedy mitts on it. So you've either got to expect eBay to refund you and either eat the loss or incur the costs of legal action, or you've got to take legal action yourself.

However, if the funds are frozen until positive feedback is left or a sufficient time period elapses with no complaint being lodged, then this problem is avoided, because non-delivery will have presumably been reported by then, or a complaint will be lodged if the goods aren't as promised.

I see no problem with the principle of withholding payment provided the seller is aware of it before he puts things up for sale. It's just something you have to agree to if you want to use the service. Whether it is (or was, as this is an old thread) clear to sellers prior to listing is another matter. It would be if people read the bumph ebay send out, but who reads all the T&Cs for anyone they deal with (other than me, that is ).

To me, more of an issue if that if eBay are going to set themselves up as as judge and jury in how to deal with incidents where there are disputes arising, how they deal with those issues is critical, because if they just side with the buyer (as they seem increasingly inclined to do these days), the legitimate seller can get ripped off.

My bet is that most buyers are legit and will pay for what they buy. But some aren't. Unless eBay are going to do a competent job of investigating cases of dispute, and resolving them based on evidence, then what it amounts to is that sellers accept that they are playing a lottery and just have to hope their buyer is legit or they could end up eating a loss. I guess you take that risk if you list stuff.

[jim]

I see no problem with the principle of withholding payment provided the seller is aware of it before he puts things up for sale. It's just something you have to agree to if you want to use the service. Whether it is (or was, as this is an old thread) clear to sellers prior to listing is another matter. It would be if people read the bumph ebay send out, but who reads all the T&Cs for anyone they deal with (other than me, that is )

That's precisely the problem: it's completely random. You have no idea they're going to do it, and then all of a sudden the £200 you thought you had to spend on a holiday, actually won't be around for an extra 3 weeks.

So effectively now, every time you sell on eBay, you have to factor in that there's a certain probability that your money won't appear for quite a while. And of course the fact that it applies to Paypal transactions means there's no escape - there's no option to not accept Paypal. I still find it unbelievable that the world's biggest auction site can force its customers to use the world's biggest online-only personal payments service.

I think the other side of it is that they're treating you as a criminal. Now, if I registered on eBay as a new seller, and put three iPhones and a graphics card on sale, I don't think I'd be surprised. If I've been registered as a seller for years, with several happy customers over that period, I think it's extremely unreasonable and accusatory to start restricting payments in that manner. I'm not saying it's illegal, just that it's a very poor way to treat the people who effectively keep your business afloat.

[Zak33]

it only effect my transactions from the point the email arrived.
However.. by then I'd listed a load of stuff and half was selling. I'm not actually bothered.. I don't need the money for a few weeks...

BUT.. here's the problem. If the bloke buying the graphics card is a knob end and can't install it properly I'm snookered.

I've managed without Paypal for YEARS.. but I have to sell my kit now, I need the income, and I have NO choice

To top it of, I recongnised that I'd prolly sell more than £1700 this year. It's all mine, I paid retail for everything, and will sel for less than I purcased. Every bit of it. But I had to upgrade my account. I am sure I did it right, because most options were for charity's/business etc.. I chose non profit and fought my way through the pre set options.

2 days later I've got to provide 3 lots of proofs, via upload or fax, to prove that I'm a charity! Which I'm not. So I've uploaded signed documents stating I'm a private dude and will be making no profit on any of the stuff I'm selling and I own every piece of it.. but al three show as "in progress" or "awaiting my documents"

Silly system. If I could create a HEXUS.bank I would.

[Saracen]

That's precisely the problem: it's completely random. You have no idea they're going to do it, and then all of a sudden the £200 you thought you had to spend on a holiday, actually won't be around for an extra 3 weeks.

So effectively now, every time you sell on eBay, you have to factor in that there's a certain probability that your money won't appear for quite a while. And of course the fact that it applies to Paypal transactions means there's no escape - there's no option to not accept Paypal. I still find it unbelievable that the world's biggest auction site can force its customers to use the world's biggest online-only personal payments service.

I think the other side of it is that they're treating you as a criminal. Now, if I registered on eBay as a new seller, and put three iPhones and a graphics card on sale, I don't think I'd be surprised. If I've been registered as a seller for years, with several happy customers over that period, I think it's extremely unreasonable and accusatory to start restricting payments in that manner. I'm not saying it's illegal, just that it's a very poor way to treat the people who effectively keep your business afloat.

That's why I said I see no problem with the principle .... the actual implementation is a bit different.

I was aware of it, but not sure why. It must either have been in their T&Cs, or in the bumph I get by email whenever they change them ... you know, all the gobbledegook most people either file unread, or just delete.

My point was that users should know about it, and therefore should plan on the delay, and be glad if it doesn't happen, rather than not be aware and be shocked when it does.

Should eBay to more to make people aware? Probably, but mainly because most people don't read the detail of changed T&Cs, when really, as it's a contract, they should. One also wonders if that's precisely why such things aren't more clearly highlighted .... such as by a warning note on the page you use when you enter a listing.

I don't see a problem with the principle of what they've done, but don't much like the way they've done it.

[TooNice]

Oh. So that's why one of the recent seller sent a follow up email asking for a feedback (rarely happens when it's a major seller). I always leave the feedback, but at my leisure, at the moment, I am just wondering whether I should be nice with my feedback. The product I received is different from pictured (lower specification), though it is adequate for my needs.

[mikerr]

I am just wondering whether I should be nice with my feedback.

Of course you should.. look at your username

The product I received is different from pictured (lower specification), though it is adequate for my needs.

Email the seller, and see how they respond (see if they offer to return, or partial refund)

I sold a dell netbook recently and the buyer complained it didn't have bluetooth

- I'd copy pasted the spec without noticing it mentioned bluetooth (which mine didn't have)

So I offered the buyer a (generous I thought) £25 refund which they accepted.
Then they left feedback saying "item not as described, missing features - but resolved"
which is more than slightly misleading IMO...

I've not had any 21 day holds yet, I wonder what triggers it?

[petercook7]

well iam about to sell somthing on ebay hope it goes well

[jim]

Bumpage!

[phoenix198]

well iam about to sell somthing on ebay hope it goes well

Eek! So am I, and the auction finishes in something like 19 hrs!

[Tattysnuc]

This sort of thing makes my blood boil. I've been a victim of identify fraud on Ebay, and neither ebay nor paypal would cover the £100+ transaction. In the end I ended logging the call with the FBI and have not heard anythig about it since.

I wish I had a friend in Nigeria who had a lot of money that they could deposit in Ebay's pay-pal account, then I think a poetic end could be in sight.... Be great to see how they deal with the amount of fraudlulent or suspected fraudulent activities that sellers have to sift through.

[CrazyMonkey]

Had this when selling a phone, they held my money until i received positive feedback...

Sold another phone (higher value too) and did not have to go through this process...

Don't understand their algorithm. I'm a fairly small ebayer (40 Positive Feedback 100%) no idea why they hold it on one and not the other..

I've sold two items on ebay (both phones) and both times i've had Nigerian scammers trying to pull a fast one..

The funniest was a man who named himself 'Terry White'..
Auction was buy-it now, he purchased the phone and i messaged him regarding payment.. Upon this process i realized he signed up no more than 10 mins before my auction ended.

He had 0 feedback of course, yet was somehow ebay verified.. He then messaged me saying he would pay £50 more than i listed it and asked me to send the item to his 'SON' in Nigeria who's name i will not even try to repeat.. He then sent me phishing scams to my email address allegedly from 'paypal' yet clearly received from a yahoo account.

The funniest thing was how 'Terrys' son was called Noahchayqyeaha or along those lines and when i phoned ebay to have my auction relisted and to report the fraudster they simply replied 'This happens a lot' and that it would cost me another £3 to list my item again... In the end ebay gain £3 due to the fraudster which is more their fault than it could ever be mine and then they have the cheek to mug me 10% of the final sale value.. Oh and then paypal stole £10...

Hate using ebay.

[Tattysnuc]

I too suffered these for ages before Ebay actually gave me some useful advice... You can block people!

It's in:

Account\My Account\Site Preferences\

there's a section called buyer requirements. It doesn't give you the facility to block all buyers with a zero score, but you can block accounts without a paypal account, Check out the other options if you haven;t come across them before, they're dead handy. I've found that things did improve when I started using this.

The problem with Ebay is that no-one polices it, it's all done with policy documents. I mean, who wants to read 40 pages of "how to" to sell a cufflink?????

Back to my homebrew..... Time to relax...