3000 founders edition cards UK

[Pob255]

Yes, there's multiple issues atm, not just fab space, the 6000 series is built on TSMC n7+, but so are the ryzen cpu's, console SoC also Apple and Huawei us it so they are all fighting for fab space, nvidia is using Samsung 8N so it's mainly fighting for fab space with mobile cpu's
fighting for fab space might be a bit hyperbolic, but it is a potential limit on production.
Actually I wonder if ms and sony pressure to fix supply shortages of consoles has put gpu production on a lower urgency for AMD as for filling these contracts is of a far greater importance?

Next we have the secondary component effects, increased demand and reduced production hasn't just effected the chips but all of the electronic components that go onto the pcb, so Bulk capacitor availability and prices could well of gone up effecting price and production.

crypto mining is still a factor, having a big chunk of demand.

Increased datacentre/AI demand while not directly effecting gaming card demand, the simularity of components could well be effecting production of gaming cards.

With high demand and supply shortages, this year we've seen a big rise in scalping, truther adding to the issues.

But my real worry is that this isn't just a one off storm but an ongoing trend that started a couple of years ago with the whole mining crisis and is just being built on year by year which is turning it into a bubble.
and if it is a bubble what the heck will happen when it finally pop's?
back in the 90's early 2000's there where quite a few companies who went under leaving us with this 2 horse race we have, granted that was more of a race for performance and market, but at the same time there were specialist workstation cards often running on far different hardware, nvidia and ati killed that market by using the same chip design for both pro and gaming cards (I seem to remember that a big chunk of the original geforce chip was based off a Licensed 3DLabs Glint chipset, rip 3DLabs)

[xbloke]

However, having to rely on stock & price trackers, the same way/tools that many scalpers do, not a great situation to be in, it's one of the bad sides of a supply and demand economy.

Completely agree with you. I don't think everyone waiting some arbitrary amount of time is the logical or practical solution though. For a lot of card purchasers, myself included, it's not about higher fps, it's about working more efficiently.

At the end of the day, if we level the playing field with the scalpers then we reduce both their stock and their number of potential buyers - this is only a good thing. This is especially possible with the 30XX FEs as Scan limit them to one per person and also require captcha submission for the purchase.

Thanks to PartAlert my 3070FE arrived today, paid £469... I don't understand how it would've been better for everyone if I waited and let that card go to a scalper.

[wazzickle]

Completely agree with you. I don't think everyone waiting some arbitrary amount of time is the logical or practical solution though. For a lot of card purchasers, myself included, it's not about higher fps, it's about working more efficiently.

At the end of the day, if we level the playing field with the scalpers then we reduce both their stock and their number of potential buyers - this is only a good thing. This is especially possible with the 30XX FEs as Scan limit them to one per person and also require captcha submission for the purchase.

Thanks to PartAlert my 3070FE arrived today, paid £469... I don't understand how it would've been better for everyone if I waited and let that card go to a scalper.

That's an interesting way to look at it and that has to be figured in. The logic works better in a vacuum; outside of the vacuum, you would look at the system that creates both the opportunity for the scalpers and the necessity for legitimate consumers to go through such a ridiculous rigmarole just to get a fair deal, and conclude that the effect going the other way (difficult to quantify whether greater than the effect you mentioned, i'm sure it's possible but outside my skillset) is the fact that the prices that scalpers set are determined in part by the urgency and desperation customers feel, and by partaking in all the discords and twitters and so on (which i'm sure the scalpers check, if not use) you're contributing to that. Supply and demand works like a pressure system, in that a change in pressure far down the line needs to be equalized by something else, i.e. none of this happens in a vacuum. The least effect you could have is if you just avoid all those options and reload pages until you get one, and yes, that's one a scalper might have got, but it's also one another legitimate but desperate customer might have got and leads the scalpers to see more demand.

If you add on top of that the exponential (i think?) effect that comes from scalpers making rational decisions about what level of profit is and isn't worth their time, and seeing that this is more than worth their time leading to them contacting their mates and ramping up in order to try to take over a higher proportion of the market, it further suggests that from the point of view of a rational self-interested person who's thinking about the long term, let alone other people, is to wait a few months down the line until the market sorts itself out, because really, that's not a big ask. You've gone this long without a 3060ti, a few months more won't hurt.

[Jmurr]

I agree in part with wazzickle, but I don't think you can blame someone for buying an FE at MSRP!

Just needs other people to be disciplined and wait for their opportunity to buy an FE at MSRP, rather than get impatient and buy a scalped one. However, there are always going to be people with more money than time that would rather just get the product even if they pay over the odds for it.

I think really we should be laying the blame more at nVidia / AMD's door for failing to supply serious quantities of cards, rather than arguing with eachother

For me if I wanted to get a 3080 I might spend up to £750 for a good AIB version, if I couldn't get hold of an FE, otherwise I will do my best to wait, although when you've been excited about a new build since the announcement in September, the waiting does get frustrating!

[Zatoichi]

I think it would be simple for amd and nvidia to introduce a pre-purchaase registration database.
2 cards per bank account.
To buy more you need to declare a business account.

That way they could demonstrably support the gaming community by limiting miners. They can limit sales to single card purchases only.

They still sell all the cards they make and administering the registration is just an extension of the sh*t they do already.

Yes miner communities will get around it to a degree but whilst they adjust it would give us a chance to get them at msrp.
Won't help with individual scalpers either

But if it releases 30% of production to the ACTUAL gaming community it a win right?

[Duckboy79]

I think it would be simple for amd and nvidia to introduce a pre-purchaase registration database.
2 cards per bank account.
To buy more you need to declare a business account.

That way they could demonstrably support the gaming community by limiting miners. They can limit sales to single card purchases only.

They still sell all the cards they make and administering the registration is just an extension of the sh*t they do already.

Yes miner communities will get around it to a degree but whilst they adjust it would give us a chance to get them at msrp.
Won't help with individual scalpers either

But if it releases 30% of production to the ACTUAL gaming community it a win right?

I wish this could happen, but it takes far too much common sense for it to ever happen, one can only wish.

[Jmurr]

I don't really believe nvidia minds who they sell their gpu's to all that much

They reportedly sold a large quantity in a separate batch to miners

So I can't really seem them too much out of their way to ensure individual gamers specifically get them, but I am perhaps a bit of a cynic

[Kovoet]

Seen loads of these on facebook marketplace. Even I wouldn't buy them off there but why are they selling them.

[Pob255]

I don't really believe nvidia minds who they sell their gpu's to all that much

They reportedly sold a large quantity in a separate batch to miners

So I can't really seem them too much out of their way to ensure individual gamers specifically get them, but I am perhaps a bit of a cynic

Nope you're correct, Miners are big business now, they buy cards by the pallet not a few from retailers/websites
and yes they'll have business accounts with nvidia, they'll not be paying retail price ether, probably they are offering slightly higher than trade price, which is still a chunk less than rrp but makes them a more interesting offer than most most retailers/distributers who will be pushing to lower the trade price so they can make higher returns without lowering the point of sale price or lower the point of sale price to try to grab market share without impacting returns.
Most retailers don't scalp because they no what the effect on reputation will be in the long run, if they are selling above rrp then it's probably more down to increased Trade prices and that's miners and limiting retail sales too 1 gpu per-customer isn't going to change that, miners will already have there big bulk shipments of cards.

The biggest damage in availability atm is scalpers, it's a very difficult thing to do well, you have to predict what's going to sell and how much you can get away with over rrp, you have to get in when it's hot but before it's run out or the price has gone up then sell when demand is highest and supply lowest to get the most inflated price you can.
Now don't get me wrong, scalpers are scum, but it's not an easy thing to do well for a long time (many can get lucky once but that's it)

[Jmurr]

Nope you're correct, Miners are big business now, they buy cards by the pallet not a few from retailers/websites
and yes they'll have business accounts with nvidia, they'll not be paying retail price ether, probably they are offering slightly higher than trade price, which is still a chunk less than rrp but makes them a more interesting offer than most most retailers/distributers who will be pushing to lower the trade price so they can make higher returns without lowering the point of sale price or lower the point of sale price to try to grab market share without impacting returns.
Most retailers don't scalp because they no what the effect on reputation will be in the long run, if they are selling above rrp then it's probably more down to increased Trade prices and that's miners and limiting retail sales too 1 gpu per-customer isn't going to change that, miners will already have there big bulk shipments of cards.

The biggest damage in availability atm is scalpers, it's a very difficult thing to do well, you have to predict what's going to sell and how much you can get away with over rrp, you have to get in when it's hot but before it's run out or the price has gone up then sell when demand is highest and supply lowest to get the most inflated price you can.
Now don't get me wrong, scalpers are scum, but it's not an easy thing to do well for a long time (many can get lucky once but that's it)

I feel like some retailers, or someone in the chain at least is scalping to some extent, most of the prices I've seen I don't think I'd pay. Think I've seen Gigabyte gaming oc 3070 for like £670/680 which is more than a 3080FE!

I just hope that it doesn't take too much longer for some sensible prices and a bit of availability! Been waiting a fair few months now...

Would like to just put it off and ignore it all for a couple months til things are better, but don't seem to be able to do that very well at the moment stuck at home!

[Pob255]

oh that's just overclockers, they've never been shameless when price gouging, but they just keep getting away with it.

Have a look on amazon marketplace, there are people who want £900+

I give to you "Beauty Masters" https://www.amazon.co.uk/s?me=A7FNDQ...A1F83G8C2ARO7P
who sell skin care products and have Two whole Gigabyte GeForce RTX 3070 GAMING OC 8GB Graphics Cards for just £932 each

That is a scalper, when you have low availability and add in a bunch of scum like that and you get the situation we're in.

Miners do effect the situation, they divert stock before it can get to retail and push up whole sale prices (again I agree with you that trying to ban miners from retail is pointless because they don't buy retail)

what I keep trying to get at is that it's not a single cause and effect, there's lots of factors going on, they are stacking together atm to really make things bad which in turn are having other knock on effects eg the crazy 2nd hand market
One thing I also concede that is possible is lots of little price rises along the supply chain, esp if there is reduced production, the many steps on the chain will rise prices to cover the loss in volume.
However that should all be shown in the RRP not just the point of sale price.

here's another interesting point only people who have stock are people who are selling high above rrp

[dannyboy75]

oh that's just overclockers, they've never been shameless when price gouging

Or Overchargers, as I affectionately like to call them...

[fisnik]

Just a quick question.

I've been looking for the 3060ti Founder's Edition since I missed out on launch day. Have any of these FE cards ever been made available by Nvidia since? I can't even find them listed on any retailer anywhere, let alone find one in stock!

[Diabo593]

Yes but not too often and you have to be quick.

[Alsedo]

I got a new RTX 3070 Founders Edition for RRP on the 6th by following a bot on Telegram. It went completely smoothly, unlike on launch day when I kept getting timeouts and eventually failed.

[TamoorW]

Nvidia randomly drop them through Scan and they're gone in 2 minutes. Last drop was on 11/01/2021. Joining a Discord or Telegram stock alert group is the only chance you have of getting one.