Reactivating Vista after Mobo Change

[DecomposingStar]

At least people who buy the OEM version have actually bought it, lets face it any one of us here can go and download a fully working version of vista ultimate (newer cracks even fully update) and screw Microsoft totally.

If Microsoft had a problem with people buying and using OEM software then it wouldn`t be available to buy from website shops, they know you will get around any activation issues after changing hardware and expect it to happen and to be frank, if your stupid enough to spend over £300 on a retail version of an OS then thats your problem.

Well said.

Software is not an object, it isn't something you can hold. I don't have a problem with paying MS because i know alot of labour has gone into it, but if i was going to pay them £300 (the same as a decent graphics card) over paying them a less painful £120.... Think about it....

I could quite easily download Vista Ultimate, change my mobo BIOS time/date up to year 2099, apply a patch to stop updates, and activation, and then away i go. But I chose not to. If i can't activate the OEM copy after some hardware changes i CERTAINLY won't be spending a bunch more money for thr retail copy, or even another OEM to be honest. I'd rather revert to XP.

[this_is_gav]

It makes no difference though - if you treat an OEM license as a Retail one, then that license holds no value and you're still partaking in piracy.

You can't justify it by saying, "well, at least they got some money".

Anyway, I'm bored now, so won't post anymore. If you want to carry on breaking licenses, then that's up to you. If you want something for nothing, I suggest one of the many free Linux distros - it's more in keeping with your idea of a license.

[DecomposingStar]

It makes no difference though - if you treat an OEM license as a Retail one, then that license holds no value and you're still partaking in piracy.

You can't justify it by saying, "well, at least they got some money".

Anyway, I'm bored now, so won't post anymore. If you want to carry on breaking licenses, then that's up to you. If you want something for nothing, I suggest one of the many free Linux distros - it's more in keeping with your idea of a license.

Yeah, sure i'll continue stealing software.... It's easy and free.

P2P anyone?

[aidanjt]

It makes no difference though - if you treat an OEM license as a Retail one, then that license holds no value and you're still partaking in piracy.

You can't justify it by saying, "well, at least they got some money".

Anyway, I'm bored now, so won't post anymore. If you want to carry on breaking licenses, then that's up to you. If you want something for nothing, I suggest one of the many free Linux distros - it's more in keeping with your idea of a license.

I think his point here is it's unreasonable to charge an extra £180 (or some such) for the 'privilege' of migrating your license to another machine, that's more than it's OEM value just for a slight license change, it's not only morally objectionable, but it's legally questionable as well. Software shouldn't be tied into hardware no matter what if's or but's you can come up with.

[this_is_gav]

OK, I'll post another.

Where are the legal implications? The normal license is £180 , the perk is that there is a one available for £70. That there is that opportunity alone should be good enough for most (as it's intended, and always has been, for OEMs, not you and I).

You don't just decide it's unreasonable and poor value to get the Retail - you choose whether to pay for it or not. If I thought the Golf GTI should be available for the same price as a more regular Golf, I wouldn't go up to VW and expect them to upgrade me for nothing.

You pay your monies and you make your choices.

[aidanjt]

A better comparison is buying a Golf GTI and having to pay more for the permission to take it out of the city. And thus the questionable legality of the EULA, whether anyone contends it in the courts or not is another matter. At the end of the day the product costs nearly the same to develop, manufacture and ship (retail costing roughly 40p extra). Sure Microsoft can charge whatever they want, and they do, 'free' market and all that crud, it doesn't make it right in any way.

[switchmode]

I wonder what the real cost of Vista is ? I think that to force you to pay more just because you may want to upgrade your hardware is just wrong, after all if you have paid a fair price (The retail prices seem to be just ridiculous considering the economy of scale) perhaps in the future the OS may be built in to the motherboard and Microsoft will be replaced by a less bloated system. perhaps thats just wishfull thinking .

[aidanjt]

The LinuxBIOS project has already got images for some motherboards, who knows

[kalniel]

A better comparison is buying a Golf GTI and having to pay more for the permission to take it out of the city.

But where in buying the car are you ever given the impression that it should only be used within a city?

The OEM version has a pretty clear license condition. If you want different, you buy different.

We have no right whatsoever to say 'well I don't think this is good value so I'll pirate it' or whatever. If you don't think it's good value then don't buy it - otherwise you'll only make things worse. We need people to vote with their feet or the market won't change.

[DecomposingStar]

But where in buying the car are you ever given the impression that it should only be used within a city?

The OEM version has a pretty clear license condition. If you want different, you buy different.

We have no right whatsoever to say 'well I don't think this is good value so I'll pirate it' or whatever. If you don't think it's good value then don't buy it - otherwise you'll only make things worse. We need people to vote with their feet or the market won't change.

I think that's the point. If you bought a car and they said you can only use it in this city, 6otherwise you'd have to pay more than twice as much, what would you do?!

As for the Golf GTI/Golf analogy, that's like more suited to comparing Vista HP and Vista Ultimate, one has more functions and more power... The difference between OEM and Retail is the fairly lax "use once" policy.

Besides the point, if anyone HAS the phone number for MS in order to reactivate, can they please PM it to me? I remember what happened last time i had to reactive XP, it said "Windows must be reactivated" and when you press "Reactivation options" it said "Windows is already activated".
I don't want this to happen again.

[aidanjt]

But where in buying the car are you ever given the impression that it should only be used within a city?

The OEM version has a pretty clear license condition. If you want different, you buy different.

We have no right whatsoever to say 'well I don't think this is good value so I'll pirate it' or whatever. If you don't think it's good value then don't buy it - otherwise you'll only make things worse. We need people to vote with their feet or the market won't change.

There's a huge difference between the automotive market and the Operating System market, you can get the same car accessories for practically any make or model of a car and any car can drive any part of the road along side other makes of car, the same can't be said for Operating Systems, if VW tried to impose such licensing restrictions (and explicitly said you don't own the car, you're just buying the right to use it) you'd tell them to swing their hook and buy from another manufacturer.

In terms of Operating Systems, if you want to send/receive documents to/from customers and other businesses you need MS Office, which only realistically works with Windows, also if you're a home user and/or gamer you're also locked into the Windows trap. That makes 'voting with your feet' impossible with Microsoft's virtual monopoly.

I'm not saying you should pirate Windows, but at the same time violating a ridiculous part of the OEM EULA isn't theft, it's breach of contract at best, assuming Microsoft wouldn't be laughed out of court in the process of attempting to pursue such a violation.

[Clunk]

Is it really piracy though? £70 seems quite expensive for a pirated copy.

[fat jez]

I think his point here is it's unreasonable to charge an extra £180 (or some such) for the 'privilege' of migrating your license to another machine, that's more than it's OEM value just for a slight license change, it's not only morally objectionable, but it's legally questionable as well. Software shouldn't be tied into hardware no matter what if's or but's you can come up with.

The reason that the OEM edition is cheaper, is because you are not entitled to any support from Microsoft for it (you get that from your system builder). Therefore the extra that the retail costs not only gives you the right to move the license, but also to phone up Microsoft for support.

Cheers,
Stephen

[DecomposingStar]

The reason that the OEM edition is cheaper, is because you are not entitled to any support from Microsoft for it (you get that from your system builder). Therefore the extra that the retail costs not only gives you the right to move the license, but also to phone up Microsoft for support.

Cheers,
Stephen

Yeah, you're right, but it also states that major hardware changes have conditions aswell.

The fact that they allow you to QUITE easily by-pass their activation system just shows how much they care. Not much.

[aidanjt]

But it's still a hassle users shouldn't have to deal with, it's clearly an attempt to force legitimate users to comply with unreasonable license conditions and not stopping pirates, not that any software 'solution' will change anything as game publishers are slowly beginning to realise.

[directhex]

Is it really piracy though? £70 seems quite expensive for a pirated copy.

is it piracy? no

is it violation of the license agreement? yes

the question is "do i care about violating the license", and if so, where does one draw the line between "acceptable" and "unacceptable" license deviations?

is it okay to install OEM on an upgraded motherboard? how about on a full new PC? how about several new PCs? how about giving copies to friends too?

just because there are no technical differences between the retail and oem products, and just because it's easy to get activation codes from bored call center staff, doesn't mean it's approved of or right.

i do a little software development. i release software under certain terms - if people disagree with those terms, then they shouldn't use the software - the code and the license are part of the same bundle. if people started downloading my source code and breaking the license, i'd be livid - and microsoft have every right to feel the same way

if you don't think the most heavily used component of your pc (the os) is worth a full retail price of a couple of hundred quid, then don't use it - use an alternative. if you disagree with the terms under which the software is offered, then that software isn't worth it to you, and don't use it - use an alternative