Hamilton's 3rd Place at Australia in Question

[Madafwo]

Am I the only one thinking that instead of "The Chain" we should have Yackety Sax as theme for BBC's coverage of F1, for a clue look below ...



I understand the "deliberately misleading" information issue, but the talk of McClaren being kicked out (or however you want to put it) of the rest of the season is too much, and it would just play into the conspiracy theorists view that if it isn't Ferrari winning then something must be done.

[this_is_gav]

I think Hamilton is being treated unfairly, surely if a driver goes off the track while the safery car is out, through his own fault, then surely the driver can't expect to just slot back into position?

Now if he were forced of the track in one way or another then yes I would understand the driver being given the spot back.

But as the recording's show/ say Hamilton DID eventually let Trulli pass.

Someone's missed the point. Trulli did get penalised for overtaking Hamilton, but when it emerged he didn't overtake him, but Hamilton actually let him through, he was reinstated.

Hamilton wasn't disqualified for anything he did on the track, but for deliberately lying to the stewards afterwards, as had transpired once the radios had been studied.

I think the British public opinion that he has been unfairly treated in 2008 and his grovelling since has stopped him getting a suspended ban... well so far anyway.

Trulli does still deserve at least a slap for going off under the safety car (even if they were trying to catch the safety car), but he did nothing wrong after that point.

well at the end of the day, he was just following orders

He's 24. He's not a kid.

[iranu]

What I cannot work out is why McLaren ordered him to say what he did. He had already given an interview stating what happened, McLaren know that the FIA/stewards can look at the radio transmissions so why did they do it? Surely they could have just said, "yep we let him through because of x,y,z" - Trulli would have gotten third and 6 points and Hamilton would have gotten 5. Why did they risk this for 1 point (and worse)?

Also why didn't Hamilton stand up and say, "hold on a minute lads I can't say that, I've just given a television interview that contradicts what you are wanting me to say, now do one"?

It's this sort of crap that makes F1 look like a ridiculous sport. It's all politics with Max "spank me fräulein" Mosely and Bernie "small man syndrome" Ecclestone.

[j.o.s.h.1408]

What I cannot work out is why McLaren ordered him to say what he did. He had already given an interview stating what happened, McLaren know that the FIA/stewards can look at the radio transmissions so why did they do it? Surely they could have just said, "yep we let him through because of x,y,z" - Trulli would have gotten third and 6 points and Hamilton would have gotten 5. Why did they risk this for 1 point (and worse)?

Also why didn't Hamilton stand up and say, "hold on a minute lads I can't say that, I've just given a television interview that contradicts what you are wanting me to say, now do one"?

It's this sort of crap that makes F1 look like a ridiculous sport. It's all politics with Max "spank me fräulein" Mosely and Bernie "small man syndrome" Ecclestone.

another question is why did it take FIA/stewards 4 days to figure all this out? does it seriously take 4 days to trancode a 3min voice feed?

[this_is_gav]

It's this sort of crap that makes F1 look like a ridiculous sport. It's all politics with Max "spank me fräulein" Mosely and Bernie "small man syndrome" Ecclestone.

As popular as it is (fairly), I don't think you can blame either Mr. Kinky or the master dwarf even slightly for this.

The sport will always be as political as it is while the manufacturers have their businesses relying heavily on it. It is a sport, but it's a huge business too unfortunately.

[j.o.s.h.1408]

talk about beating a dead horse. http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/moto...ne/7985669.stm

what more punishment do you have to give to hamilton and co just for "misleading" the stewards?

[this_is_gav]

what more punishment do you have to give to hamilton and co just for "misleading" the stewards?

Essentially perjury? I think most expect a suspended ban. F1 is one of those sports where the sport aspect is very much behind the business side of it, but removing the sporting side altogether in order to lie your way to a single extra point and getting a fellow competitors points removed? Frankly I hope they throw the book at both him and McLaren. It's beyond cheating. Pure and simple.

[j.o.s.h.1408]

Essentially perjury? I think most expect a suspended ban. F1 is one of those sports where the sport aspect is very much behind the business side of it, but removing the sporting side altogether in order to lie your way to a single extra point and getting a fellow competitors points removed? Frankly I hope they throw the book at both him and McLaren. It's beyond cheating. Pure and simple.

cool lets boot him out of f1 altogether

diddnt Schumacher lied to the stewards multiple times and got away with it?

[beanbandit]

Essentially perjury? I think most expect a suspended ban. F1 is one of those sports where the sport aspect is very much behind the business side of it, but removing the sporting side altogether in order to lie your way to a single extra point and getting a fellow competitors points removed? Frankly I hope they throw the book at both him and McLaren. It's beyond cheating. Pure and simple.

I have to agree, as much as i've wanted Lewis to be the next big thing, he has to do it in a fair manner. Lying to get an extra point is just low, he knew what he was saying, he just needed to be more of a man and not agree to it. Alas he is now getting his comeuppance, ban him for 2 races i say.

cool lets boot him out of f1 altogether

diddnt Schumacher lied to the stewards multiple times and got away with it?

You do spout some crap sometimes Josh. No one is saying he should be booted out of F1. All they are saying is that he needs to be properly punished.

Lets put it a way you might finally understand. Imagine Eboue taking a dive, as he is known to do, and getting a man unjustly sent off. Now the FA can't do a thing about it, but the Ref's get to "watch" a player closer, so next time he takes a dive the ref is taking non of it, and books him or even sends him off. Now the FA can ban him Mclaren are being watched for everything they do since the spying scandal, this has to be the last straw, so hopefully the driver will get his ban.

As far as i'm aware, Schumacher never lied, what he did was to know the rules inside out and use them to his advantage. Team rules, the British win he managed while taking his penalty in the pit lane, race fixing (team rules) ramming Damon Hill out of the last race to get his first World championship, ramming Villeneauve (or should that be attempting) But he did serve a race ban if i remember rightly in 93 or 94.

[staffsMike]

To be fair to the guy, I'm sure there are no more lessons required. He would be a fool to try it again regardless of further punishments..

They just need to get on with the sport now.

[this_is_gav]

As far as i'm aware, Schumacher never lied, what he did was to know the rules inside out and use them to his advantage. Team rules, the British win he managed while taking his penalty in the pit lane, race fixing (team rules) ramming Damon Hill out of the last race to get his first World championship, ramming Villeneauve (or should that be attempting) But he did serve a race ban if i remember rightly in 93 or 94.

Schumacher got a 2 race ban in '94 for ignoring a black flag at the British GP.*

He was also disqualified from Spa, where he won, for spinning over a kerb, thus wearing his plank under the car too much.

His punishment after 1997 for trying to do to Villeneuve what he did to Hill was to have his season's points removed.

* which if you think Hamilton is treated harshly, then Schumacher indirectly got a 2 race ban for overtaking Hill on the warm-up lap. The perceived FIA harshness has been around for ages... it's just people tend to quickly forget it when it doesn't apply to someone they're supporting.

The drivers who drive close to the bone tend to be the ones who get slapped most often. That's all that happening with Hamilton. If he just did things by the book all the time, he'd not have attracted any of the controversy he has done.

To be fair to the guy, I'm sure there are no more lessons required. He would be a fool to try it again regardless of further punishments..

Which is why a suspended sentence would be the perfect 'sentence' in my opinion. Do it again he gets taken to the cleaners.

I can't see him losing points or missing races or anything. That would be a bit harsh.

[j.o.s.h.1408]

I have to agree, as much as i've wanted Lewis to be the next big thing, he has to do it in a fair manner. Lying to get an extra point is just low, he knew what he was saying, he just needed to be more of a man and not agree to it. Alas he is now getting his comeuppance, ban him for 2 races i say.



You do spout some crap sometimes Josh. No one is saying he should be booted out of F1. All they are saying is that he needs to be properly punished.

Lets put it a way you might finally understand. Imagine Eboue taking a dive, as he is known to do, and getting a man unjustly sent off. Now the FA can't do a thing about it, but the Ref's get to "watch" a player closer, so next time he takes a dive the ref is taking non of it, and books him or even sends him off. Now the FA can ban him Mclaren are being watched for everything they do since the spying scandal, this has to be the last straw, so hopefully the driver will get his ban.

As far as i'm aware, Schumacher never lied, what he did was to know the rules inside out and use them to his advantage. Team rules, the British win he managed while taking his penalty in the pit lane, race fixing (team rules) ramming Damon Hill out of the last race to get his first World championship, ramming Villeneauve (or should that be attempting) But he did serve a race ban if i remember rightly in 93 or 94.

i think a ban of 2 races is a bit too harsh. why not give him a hefty fine?

[this_is_gav]

i think a ban of 2 races is a bit too harsh. why not give him a hefty fine?

Because we all know that to sporting super-stars that means nothing (other than a bit of negative PR).

I'm not saying a 2-race ban is right, but it needs to be something which makes him think, something sporting. He tried to cheat a fellow competitor, so why give him a fine that Daddy2 would fund?

[kalniel]

Because we all know that to sporting super-stars that means nothing (other than a bit of negative PR).

Implement a budget cap, then say all fines have to come out of that budget

[j.o.s.h.1408]

Why exactly is it policy in F1 for drivers to steward themself? Lewis should not have lied tis true but if the stewards are incapable of looking at the 100 or so cameras about the track, the team radios and just looking out the window to police the sport without requiring a deposition from the drivers then what purpose do the stewards serve? No-one expects players to police themself in football, thats the refs job and if he misses something then it is just tough luck; why should F1 be so different? After all, the footy ref has to police 22 players plus subs and the managers, F1 has 3 stewards to watch 20 cars with the benefit of seeing as many replays as they want and to hear drivers responses before they make their call.

Can anybody reply to this? why cant the stewards make a decision themselves?

[this_is_gav]

How could they steward something which didn't happen?

- Trulli went off, fine
- Hamilton overtook him, fine
- Hamilton then let Trulli back through whether asked to or not, fine

Where should the stewards become involved?

There shouldn't have been anything for the stewards to do. They only acted when Trulli went ahead of Hamilton, and they did so wrongly, as he didn't overtake him, he was waved through.

The stewards were investigating the incident between Kubica and Vettel at the time, and Vettel driving around on 3 wheels.