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About LinkBacksOriginally Posted by Jay
Worried?
The last time I read about anyone in this country getting a nasty letter for torrent use, it was some pinball game IIRC, and it was about six months afterwards by the time everyone got their court orders etc together.
Careful in the showers Jay, and when you see a Category A being escorted back from the canteen having poured himself a steaming mug of hot water.....keep out of range
Davenport Lyons in action!
no, as I was only saying it to scare others but now you have made this not possible.
Torrenting films etc is against the law but they have to prove it was actually you that did it. If you use wireless then that is going to be hard to do. I honestly hope that they stop torrenting films etc as I for one are fedup with the few taking all the bandwith of the many. I can't honestly belive that there are that many people torrenting.
ps
I also think the system has had enough money out of me as I bought 5 HD DVDs and 4 Blu-ray disks in the last few months, they are REALLY expensive!
Last edited by Jay; 26-02-2008 at 02:31 PM.
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9 discs over a few months is not much ...
All Hail the AACS : 09 F9 11 02 9D 74 E3 5B D8 41 56 C5 63 56 88 C0
9 disks at £30 a pop over two months isn't much? anyway, that wasn't the point of my post.
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The most I have paid for mine is about £16. But we'll just get back to the topic at hand.
All Hail the AACS : 09 F9 11 02 9D 74 E3 5B D8 41 56 C5 63 56 88 C0
Where from? PM me so we don't take this thread off topic.
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Without commenting on the core issue of this thread, i would challenge one theme that runs through this thread, which is the "innocent until proven guilty" theme.
There are two separate court systems in the UK - criminal and civil. If you're accused of a crime, you'll go before the criminal courts (Magistrates, Crown Court, etc), and if convicted, you'll face sanctions like fines, jail, etc. And then, yes, "innocent until proven guilty" is the required standard of proof.
But most copyright issues are civil disputes. Yes, there are criminal offences and yes, it could happen, but that's pretty rare. What's going on here is an allegation of copyright being infringed, and the rights holder suffering as a result, and therefore seeking damages for their loss, and perhaps injunctions to prevent further infringements and/or seizure orders for infringing copies.
And all that goes before the civil courts (County Court, etc), not criminal courts, and the standard of proof in civil courts is VERY different. In a criminal case, on the one side, you have the full investigative power of the police and resources of the state brought to bear. So the standard they have to achieve is proof beyond reasonable doubt, and yes, you are presumed innocent until proven guilty.
But in a civil court, you aren't going to be found guilty or not guilty of anything. It's a dispute between two parties, and the court is supposed to be an independent arbiter as to the right and wrong of the situation. A dispute resolution service, if you like. And then, the standard of proof is that facts must be proven on the balance of probabilities using the evidence before the court.
So ... law lecture over- back to the thread.
Unless the infringement is of a scale and in the circumstances where it becomes a criminal matter (such as you're doing it for a business), then if you end up before any court it'll be a civil one, and if that happens, forget any notion of them having to prove anything beyond reasonable doubt, and forget any presumption of innocence until proven guilty, because nobody is actually trying to prove you guilty of anything. It's a balance of probabilities thing .... and THAT gives the court far more latitude to assume that if it walks like a duck, quacks like a duck, and is covered in duck feathers, then it's obviously a duck.
And that gives rise to a problem, which is why I've often said that the law is a tool for the wealthy. If a company like this decides to sue you, you have two and only two choices - pay up, or defend yourself ... and the latter can be seriously inconvenient, time-consuming and expensive.
And if anyone is downloading or, worse yet, uploading copyright material, you ARE taking that risk. It might be a small one, or very small one, but it's there.
dangel (13-03-2008)
Good post that - thanks for taking the time.
Crosshair VIII Hero (WIFI), 3900x, 32GB DDR4, Many SSDs, EVGA FTW3 3090, Ethoo 719
Saracen that was a top notch post.
ps
The risk of being found uploading copyrighted material is not as small as most people think.
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