Never mind fox hunting.....

[Big RICHARD]

How instant is a bullet through the head? And it isn't just a nip, it the foxes neck breaking! Using a word like 'nip' makes it sound so harmless!

[lynni]

How instant is a bullet through the head? And it isn't just a nip, it the foxes neck breaking! Using a word like 'nip' makes it sound so harmless!

But the fox will be killed nether the less.... leave me alone u lot, ive got work to do and i cant when i keep posting to this

[Auran]

For those of you that seem to be under the impression that shooting foxes is a cost efficient, humane and viable alternative to hunting, please read the following;

1. Foxes are primarily a nocturnal animal and thus you have to hunt them at night. Thus you require low light or infra red scopes to be able to see what you're shooting. Now unless you've got military standard hardware hitting anything other than a stationary target is like trying to hit a dartboard in a howling gail

2. The cost of holding a licence for a hunting rifle is prohibitive and difficult to obtain. Thus you will have to pay a licenced marksman and they cost a lot of money and you'd be lucky to get hold of one most of the time. There is a lot more work / money for them in Scotland.

3. When you shoot at something you don't aim for the head because it is a small target and is the one part an animal will keep moving at all times to be aware of its surroundings. Thus you aim at the body and unless you hit the heart or another vital organ it will take hours if not days to die.

As an aside, from a political viewpoint, this has got nothing to do with logic or sense. It is an atavistic anti-class action taken by a popularist government that isn't interested in doing the right thing, but pandering to the idiotic intentions of its party activists and pressure groups. Otherwise if this decision was based on ethical grounds they would be banning Fishing as well. But what a surprise it is the UK's biggest past-time with over 4 million participants - lots of lovely voters that they want to keep happy !!

[G4Z]

look right, im not bothered what you say about cost and stuff, there are alternatives, pro-hunters just refuse to admit it. according to what I have read on the net fox hunting accounts for 3% of the fox population and the effect it has is negligable, so why do it? oh yeah... because you people enjoy seeing animals torn apart. we are supposed to be an intellegent species we should be beyond this kind of thing, the people taking part in this kind of thing are clearly lagging behind the rest of us in terms of how evolved they are... maybe sommat to do with habbitual incest...

also you cant complain about fishing as almost all fishermen return the fish they have caught so its hardly the same thing. I am not into fishing myself but if they dont harm the fish and return them to where they came from I cant see a problem with it. More important are the issues of fishing at sea decimating fish stocks. basicaly we have to stop eating fish now or we are gonna end up with a lot of extinct types of fish.

[G4Z]

also lynni, if this wasnt a class issue we wouldnt be having this argument because it would have been already made illegal years ago.

also lynni, you have seen a hunt, can you please describe to me exactly what happened, how did the fox die? how long did it take?? you keep telling us you have seen it but dont seem to want to share the experience. also how did you feel when that fox died? did you feel happy about it?

[lynni]

ok well im withdrawing my opinions from this discussion from now on, i no longer care... if your against it then fine its obvious no amount of talking from me, Auran or any of the other pro hunters are going to change the ignorance in this thread

[Skii]

I still say release the hounds - let wild dogs rip 'em apart, the way nature intended

[Angus]

look right, im not bothered what you say about cost and stuff, there are alternatives, pro-hunters just refuse to admit it. according to what I have read on the net fox hunting accounts for 3% of the fox population and the effect it has is negligable, so why do it? oh yeah... because you people enjoy seeing animals torn apart. we are supposed to be an intellegent species we should be beyond this kind of thing, the people taking part in this kind of thing are clearly lagging behind the rest of us in terms of how evolved they are... maybe sommat to do with habbitual incest...

also you cant complain about fishing as almost all fishermen return the fish they have caught so its hardly the same thing. I am not into fishing myself but if they dont harm the fish and return them to where they came from I cant see a problem with it. More important are the issues of fishing at sea decimating fish stocks. basicaly we have to stop eating fish now or we are gonna end up with a lot of extinct types of fish.

you don't think that having a metal hook with a barb stuck through the top of your palate isn't going to hurt??

the issue is not just with the fish that are caught, but also the environmental impact they have on other species; when I walk down my local canal there is normally litter in the active fishing areas, including fishing line. Now don't tell me that a duck that gets caught up in that sort of stuff isn't going to die a prettty nasty death.

[G4Z]

lynni, I want to hear your argument, I want you to tell me what you saw! show some evidence to back up your argument and Il look at it.

tbh, it should be banned anyway for the simple reason that its what the majority want and we live ina democracy. If a small minority decided they wanted to go round naked all day every day Im sure that most people would object (I wouldnt, they can do what they want as long as they dont hurt any1) and they wouldnt be allowed to do it and rightly so! same thing applies here, what fox hunters do is found distasteful by the majority and the majority wants it banned.

[lynni]

lynni, I want to hear your argument, I want you to tell me what you saw! show some evidence to back up your argument and Il look at it.

tbh, it should be banned anyway for the simple reason that its what the majority want and we live ina democracy. If a small minority decided they wanted to go round naked all day every day Im sure that most people would object (I wouldnt, they can do what they want as long as they dont hurt any1) and they wouldnt be allowed to do it and rightly so! same thing applies here, what fox hunters do is found distasteful by the majority and the majority wants it banned.

As ive already stated im no longer prepared to get involved in this discussion, i have far more important things to be doing right now like a 3,000 word essay with a deadline on thursday... why would u want to hear my argument? to flame me further, its not as tho your gonna change anyway is it? so therefore a waste of my time and energy

[Skii]

tbh, it should be banned anyway for the simple reason that its what the majority want and we live ina democracy. If a small minority decided they wanted to go round naked all day every day Im sure that most people would object (I wouldnt, they can do what they want as long as they dont hurt any1) and they wouldnt be allowed to do it and rightly so! same thing applies here, what fox hunters do is found distasteful by the majority and the majority wants it banned.

Interested in seeing your source for that G4Z m8

[G4Z]

Angus, I used to live next to a big river when I was a kid and I knew people who were into fishing, got to say I never seen any of what you describe. litter is a problem and we have laws against it, cant do much more than that can you? I know there is the possabillity that its painful for the fish but we have no evidence either way, in any case they fish will be put back in the water and will recover fully so its hardly the same as fox hunting. tbh I dont think I am a difficult person to argue with, show me a good case and some evidence and it will look at it objectively. tbh I think the problem here is that your arguments are basicaly bad and flawed and that is why your unable to convince me. not because im difficult to convince.

[G4Z]

how about this skii? : http://www.mori.com/polls/1999/ms990715.shtml

Q2 And now some questions about hunting wild mammals with dogs (eg fox hunting and stag hunting). To what extent do you support or oppose a ban on hunting with dogs in Britain?

%
Strongly support a ban
52
Tend to support a ban
11
Neither support nor oppose a ban
11
Tend to oppose a ban
10
Strongly oppose a ban
14
Don't know/no opinion
2

[lynni]

Angus, I used to live next to a big river when I was a kid and I knew people who were into fishing, got to say I never seen any of what you describe. litter is a problem and we have laws against it, cant do much more than that can you? I know there is the possabillity that its painful for the fish but we have no evidence either way, in any case they fish will be put back in the water and will recover fully so its hardly the same as fox hunting. tbh I dont think I am a difficult person to argue with, show me a good case and some evidence and it will look at it objectively. tbh I think the problem here is that your arguments are basicaly bad and flawed and that is why your unable to convince me. not because im difficult to convince.

Ok well not only is this dissussion annoying me, but im annoying myself one for getting involved after ive said i would and two cos ive got work to do

Have u read the whole thread from the start? cos ive been putting my reasons up from the beginning, alot of them are from personal experiences with the fox.... are my opinions bad and flawed because ive not gone into graphic depths of a hunt?

[G4Z]

yes, you keep saying I havent seen it but you dont wnat to say in detail what you saw. No I havent seen it and yes I think I would like to know to help me form a more informed opinion on it.

also yes I have read this whole thread and I find your arguments for fox hunting to be rather weak.

[lynni]

yes, you keep saying I havent seen it but you dont wnat to say in detail what you saw. No I havent seen it and yes I think I would like to know to help me form a more informed opinion on it.

also yes I have read this whole thread and I find your arguments for fox hunting to be rather weak.

Well then there isnt much point me going any further is there? if u dont believe me now, and find my arguments weak whats the point me putting up something on here which will have me flamed further?

Now i really am withdrawing my opinions from this discussion