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Will the theatrix use the same drivers as the TV Wonder elite, or we'll have to wait until sapphire releases them (new versions, etc)?
Andrzej: Will there be a sharpness control in the theatrix drivers?
Will the theatrix use the same drivers as the TV Wonder elite, or we'll have to wait until sapphire releases them (new versions, etc)?
Yippee! Here we go...
1. Have confidence in the award winning reviews for your products (eg Multimedia Center and Theater Chips) and the fact that they have always worked best together. Have faith that your customer base knows this and has always bought your AIW and TV cards (with ATI Theater Rage/100/200 cips) because they work really well together with your proprietary MMC software. It's a winning combination, and it makes no sense to switch horses in midstream as I've said.
2.If you're shooting for a wider base than the hi tech crowd, why not alter the software with hands off presets, or an "easy" mode that caters to techno challenged folks. But, by all means, keep the advanced functions and configurability for those who want total control over your cutting edge hardware. Many of the complaints of this Chip's capture quality are a direct result of it's lack of configurability. Being able to adjust filters, bitrates, or resolution can make a huge difference in the quality of the captured file, and allows users to find an appropriate balance between filesize and quality for their purposes. There's a difference between the choices you make when you're shooting for highest quality archival results and those you make when you're just recording 'Oprah' while you're at work. Experimentation frequently allows the user to make better choices than the factory settings.
Whatever happens, *DON'T* farm the software development out to a third party (Cyberlink) who will create a dumbed down product of dubious quality. It doesn't showcase the 550 Pro chip well at all. It just makes it look bad. Think Porsche engine in a Volkswagen Beetle...
3.If you're going to release a next generation product like the Theater 550 Pro Chip, and you've made the impression through your press releases that it will be compatible with that same software your customers have come to love (MMC)... Make sure you follow through! Make it so in every product in which the chip is implemented! And don't release it until it works. I've mentioned it before, but simply removing said promises from your website doesn't erase our memories of them. Your eagerly anticipating customer base will be disappointed, disgruntled and mistrustful of promises you will make henceforth. In short, don't promise "Vaporware".
4.If -for whatever reasons- you absolutely aren't going to allow full functionality in your cheaper cards, at least give your customer base the option of buying a higher end card (AIW) that does implement the chip and MMC together. Do this *RIGHT AWAY*. Don't make us wait for the AIW X900 or something to be released far off in the future. As Blakev said, waiting long for a product to arrive will invariably cause folks to become soured and look elsewhere. As it stands, many folks feel that way right now about ATI not coming through on it's promises of the T550P chip in the TV Wonder Elite and it's clones. To add insult to injury, the AIW X800XT will still have the Theater 200 chip. No help there... What's next? Will the only AIW release of the T550P be in a PCIexpress 16x that won't work with my AGP board? That'll be the last straw. I'd spend much more money and switch to Matrox or Canopus just to show you what mad really is.
Last edited by e.lectronick; 16-02-2005 at 07:48 PM.
I am avid MCE 2005 users and love the interface. I have been using the Sapphire version of the 550 Pro chip and quite honestly have been very disappointed in its performance. Color accuracy is good but the shortcomings I observed are as follows:Originally Posted by Andrzej
Just to make sure everyone has the same view of the world...
1) If you are looking for advice before buying a product (any product !) - then the Hexus forums are a great place to put your questions
2) If you have bought a product and have a technical query - then you really need to ask the manufacturer's support team. They will have support sections on their web site etc and these people are professionals who have been specially trained on that particular product
3) If you have a comment on a new version of the Catalyst driver - then you might find it best to submit it to ATI Technical Support directly. The 'ideal' process for getting support is listed here.. http://www.ati.com/support/contact.html
...else...
4) If you have any other (i.e. non-purchase/support/driver) query, then maybe I can help you get an answer
Does that make sense ?
I will try to help with anything - but this 1-2-3-4 should ensure the best possible route to a 'good answer'
As far as the proposed interview goes...
...you can post any questions you like...
...it will be down to the Hexus Hierarchy to decide which ones they want to put forward
1. High motion scenes are really bad. My current tuner card is a Sony card with the Conexant 416 chipset which definitely performs better than the 550 Pro.
2. Upclose facial detail is absolutely horrendous. People's faces look like their made out of clay. Completely un-natural looking.
3. When part of the scene is deliberately out of focus, say the camera is focused on someone or something in the background and the forground is out of focus, the artifacts in the out of focus portion of the screen is very annoying. Even my 16 year old son made a comment even though I didn't tell him that I changed tuner cards. He said "hey Dad, what did you do to the Media Center that made the picture look so bad"?
4. The card does run significantly hotter than my Sony card.
Since I've given the 550 Pro a fair chance of proving itself, I have since removed it from my system in hopes that driver updates will improve the shortcomings. Will future ATI drivers be compatible with the Sapphire Theatrix?
I really want this card to work well but as it stands now the way it is I cannot justify putting it back in my system unless improvements are made.
Andrezj
Ditto to e.lectronick's comments, except as to the Matrox and Canopus cards. I bought the 550 expecting it to surpass the 150's I have because of all the hype. I have not yet installed or compared it because of all the negative accounts about the software. My questions:
1) Can you fix the native software to give full bitrate control? I see it can only encode in 1000 increments.
2) Can MMC software be made to work with the card? Perhaps you could have an AIW MMC (which I have) and a 550 MMC.
3) Can you make the sdk or driver details available to GBPVR etc so that they can make their software operate the 550? Right now I use GBPVR to operate my 2 150's. Hauppauge doesn't seem to care--it encourages 3rd party software support.
4) Does ATI realize its 550 products will sell better if many third party PVR's operate it well?
5) The ATI TV Wonder Pro card with the Conexant chip gets MMC support; why not the 550?
6) Can a 550 be teamed with an AIW when both can't use MMC?
To build a better mouse trap than Hauppauge, you need a better software engine. The 550 appears to have more horsepower than the 150/250/350, but with that "lawnmower governor" on the ATI engine, ATI will lose the race to Hauppauge every time. What's worse, ATI will finish only slightly ahead of AverMedia. Please do what you can to give this card the software support it needs.
Thanks for agreeing to consider these issues.
S.
Okay here we go
Questions related to Theater 550 pro and AIW in general
1) Why is not much attention payed to use/develop the best TV tuner around
............It looks like too much focus on cost saving
2) Please make the PAL (and Secam) as good as the NTSC version
............Here in the Netherlands I have difficulty with audio all the time (I own a AIW 9800 at the time)
3) Why is the mpeg produced (XP, XP pro) by capture not DVD authoring compliant??
............Vital decision point for me to buy this card yes/no. I do not want to spend much time on remuxing... Hauppauge has a big advance here.
4) Why are not more resolutions supported for video capture?
.............352x576 for PAL DVD for instance
5) Does this card get a sharpness control
6) Can this card encode audio to dolby digital yes or no
7) MACROVISION, Can ATI guarantee that macrovision only works with copyprotected material and NOT with free/own video material???
.............Bit frustrated with my existing AIW 9800 card because I cannot record from public dutch TV channels NED I, II and III. Also a vital point for my decision to buy this card yes or no
8) Please deliver software that WORKS. Test it before... I was really surprised that after waiting so many months that there were issues with software, also the lack of MMC 9.0x support was a big surprise (read disappointment)
9) will this card together with my AIW 9800 under XP?
10) is it possibly/guaranteed with delivered software to schedule recordings from standby mode.
.............Never was able to do this with my AIW 9800 card, it always recorded in some sort of NTSC mode while I am in PAL area.
11) Please improve your NPI, it #$%let me explain ATI introduces this card in september after that radio silence.... How do you think customers respond to this? a) There must be something wrong with this card. b) this is normal c) they need time to finetune hardware and software to get zero defects.. sure ATI uses 6 sigma process.....
Sorry that I have supplied such a short list ......
Last edited by neutron; 16-02-2005 at 10:58 PM.
I have a question on capturing output from a DVD player. Does it make any difference in quality if the signal is coming from progressive scan DVD player or not?
Last edited by wenis; 16-02-2005 at 10:31 PM.
I'm with you on that. When will you guys (ATI) fix the low audio problem. I have a Hauppauge 150 and the theatrix 550, and the audio is about 33% lower on the theatrix.
Are you familiar with videohelp.com? It is one of the best sources for capturing, editing and burning DVD help. It also has a great capture card list:
http://www.videohelp.com/capturecards
Those of you with the 550's could do them a favor by posting there. I have not seen any posts yet. You might also check out the tools section.
Don't worry, I don't own the site. I have just found it an invaluable resource.
S.
PS The site identified yet another 550: Diamond 550 But then again, this could be a Conexant card in sheeps clothing--Diamond
Last edited by satnav4; 17-02-2005 at 04:18 AM.
Haup MCE Cards
Do the Hauppauge card models labeled for WinMCE work with standard Windows XP Pro??
I have a Haup PVR350 but my new mobo has PCI-X slots. So...unfortunately, the PCR350 card is unusable as it does not have the universal 3-tab PCI connector. Oh well. Technology moves on.
I think the Haup150 card does have the 3 tabs but I'm looking at the model 500 as it has dual tuners and all the other goodies of the 150 (plus FM).
So, do the Haup MCE cards work with WinXPpro with no problems?
Thanks!
Joe
Yes. You will just have to use a 3rd party app like GBPVR, Sage TV, Beyond TV etc.
S.
Videohelp.com is Excellent, Please post your impressions there.
I couldn't agree more, Satnav. I've been to look at the capture card list several times for any recent posts on the Theatrix. I highly recommend those with 550 based cards post their impressions up there.
-Erik.
Hear! Hear! blakev. You're right on the money.
I just can't believe it. Talk about shooting yourself in the foot. This amazing technology is wasted without proper (eg complete) configurability built into the software. It's like putting a Porsche engine into a Volkswagen Beetle. Sure, you get a much faster Beetle, but it sure ain't no Porsche. And I think if you're going to advertise it to be a Porsche, you'd better deliver on that promise.
Just my 2 cents. But I have my ear to the ground and I guarantee you the reviewers are going to comment on this shortcoming. And when they do, you're going to lose half your buying audience. Is it really worth it? I don't think so.
-Erik.
Forget ATI... the good news is, Snapstream's Beyond TV works fabulously with the Theater 550 Pro chipset. I nearly went crazy trying to get my Theatrix card to work with PowerCinema which ATI touted for the 550 Pro chip, but it proved to be a waste of time. I don't know why ATI ever even mentioned it. Every person I've ever heard from about PowerCinema, said it's horrendous (not just bad) . Anyway... if you already have a Theater 550 Pro based card, go to the Snapstream web site and download a free trial version. Hopefully by the time the free trial runs out, ATI will have released MMC 9.04 for those of us not willing to pay the $70 US for BeyondTV. On the other hand I can't imagine ATI releasing anything that would even approach BeyondTV in functionality.
Oh yeah... I'm using WinXP Pro
Jonas
Last edited by jonaslasky; 17-02-2005 at 06:51 PM.
I just had to register to voice my support for 3d party software. I'm currently using Sagetv with 2 pvr250. I'm not that happy with the smoothness of the mpeg recorded by the pvr 250 when compared to the Theatrix 550 pro. Especially when it comes to fast action.
The problem is, the software that comes with the Theatrix is UNUSABLE, it's slow (how about 3 seconds for a channel change, and 2 seconds to move between menus), buggy, no features, poor in terms of configuring... the worst recording software I've ever used. I'll take MMC over PowerEnema 3 anyday. You can't watch tv for long before it goes into video freeze while the sound stutters... don't even think about recording something.
And Sage tv currently does not support the 550 pro. So ATI, please send them a card/sdk/whatever necessary so they can add support for it.
1. Is there a way to check to see what bit rate the 550 pro is using when recording. I have the recording quality in MCE set to Best. Does this mean that the tuner is being used to its full potential? Is there a way to adjust other settings for this card?
2. Has anyone tried the ATI TV Wonder Elite card and if so is the sound good?
The elite card is the exact same piece of hardware. Look at the pictures of the theatrix and the elite. The PCB's are exactly the same. Sapphire is just a reseller, along with the few others out there selling the 550 cards right now.
MCE has some registry settings for your bitrate that you can alter. It does change the amount of time on your recording defaults, but I never could actually see any difference in picture quality. As far as quality goes, it is going to come down to ATI releasing some drivers that allow us to mess with the sharpness.
Jonas,
Thanks for the suggestion. I checked it out and it does look like it's quite nice. I don't expect that it will allow you to use the T550P chip to it's best advantage (eg hardware MPEG2 encoding). Only MCE, and Cyberlink can do that apparently. (ATI's Multimedia Center too, hopefully).
Can you tell me what adjustments to bitrate/filters/resolutions/etc... Beyond TV allows when capturing avi? MMC used to do all of these things, just not for the 550 Pro based cards.
-Erik
Last edited by e.lectronick; 18-02-2005 at 12:52 AM.
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