New ATI Tuner Card.

[jonaslasky]

You said it yourself... you didn't get PowerCinema in the box and neither did I.
Even if one pays for one or the other. I would rather pay for something that works.
Even a stripped-down version of PowerCinema is only 20 dollars less than BeyondTV, and it still doesn't work. A free non-working PowerCinema is just as useless and valueless.

Jonas

[satnav4]

No, Powercinema 3 doesn't come with EPG... and even though it comes free with the 550pro, it's still overpriced. They should give people a discount for taking that PowerEnema cd off their hands.

Anyway, I currently have Sage tv, which doesn't support the 550pro yet. I use a user made STV (a custom sage interface) that looks exactly like MCE (link). It's similar in cost to Beyondtv, but I think it's worth it because it comes with lifetime (or as long as they stay in business) EPG. And I use it on my network - Sageclient on my wireless laptop and another client on my desktop pc.

thatdude90210

I agree any software without an EPG is too expensive at "free". Are these guys kidding? What a shot in the foot. Even Hauppauge's much critisized WinTV 2000 has a form of EPG.

Then it's pray that ATI carries through on its promise of MMC support; pray that GBPVR or GotTV or MediaPortal runs it; or, pay BTV a handsome commission.

Thanks for the info.

S.

[jonaslasky]

Apparently the burning MMC 9.04 question has also been raging in HDTV Wonder forums. I finally found a forum that looks useful. Some guy named Stephen Orr, who claims to be an ATI Multimedia director, says MMC 9.04 will no longer be released. Instead 9.06 will be the next public release. He promises that all TV Wonder issues in addition of HDTV Wonder issues will be addressed by that software. He seems to be legit based on this interview:

http://www.driverheaven.net/dhinterviews/stephenorr/

The page of the forum in which he talks about MMC 9.06 is here:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...&pagenumber=86 look for his name to find his post.

So anyway.. forget 9.04... it looks like a dud..... think 9.06 and hope it really fixes everything.

Also... contrary to what Andrej said... Mr. Orr said MMC 9.06 will be available for download from the ATI web site.

Jonas

[satnav4]

Apparently the burning MMC 9.04 question has also been raging in HDTV Wonder forums. I finally found a forum that looks useful. Some guy named Stephen Orr, who claims to be an ATI Multimedia director, says MMC 9.04 will no longer be released. Instead 9.06 will be the next public release. He promises that all TV Wonder issues in addition of HDTV Wonder issues will be addressed by that software. He seems to be legit based on this interview:

http://www.driverheaven.net/dhinterviews/stephenorr/

The page of the forum in which he talks about MMC 9.06 is here:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...&pagenumber=86 look for his name to find his post.

So anyway.. forget 9.04... it looks like a dud..... think 9.06 and hope it really fixes everything.

Also... contrary to what Andrej said... Mr. Orr said MMC 9.06 will be available for download from the ATI web site.

Jonas

Jonas

Thanks for following up for us cheap guys.

Here is Orr's quote:

"To all,

It's been a long long while since I last posted, but I need to step in here. I have asked pohnl NOT to host our CD for a number of reasons. The most obvious is the fact that these CDs contain royalty bearing software that ATI pays money for on each and every copy, as a result we are legally bound to track and control the distribution of this software.

There are, however other reasons that should be a concern to people beyond the legal ones :-)

This version of MMC was not made available on the ATI Web site for very good reasons. The testing we did was focused on the HDTV Wonder to the exclusion of a lot of other devices, most notably the entire AIW product line. There are known issues with MMC 9.04 and various other ATI products. In addition there are serious issues if MMC 9.04 is "mix and matched" with other previous ATI Multimedia packages.

We have a newer version of MMC, version 9.06 that is in the final phases of begin tested specificially to produce a Web downloadable version. That version is being tested with all supported AIW, TV Wonder, and HDTV Wonder cards as well as all current versions of the Remote Wonder.

I strongly recommend that you wait for that version of MMC and not try to use 9.04.

Stephen Orr
Director, Multimedia Applications
ATI Technologies.

P.S. I will monitor this thread for a little while and try to answer concerns around MMC availability on the Web."


S.

[miochza]

But will MMC 9.06 support the Theatrix chip?

[satnav4]

But will MMC 9.06 support the Theatrix chip?

The ATI TV Wonder Elite is one of the Wonder series. I take his comments to mean it will support the Theater 550 chip.

This is hopeful supposition on my part. It is bolstered by the manual that promises MMC support.

S.

[satnav4]

Here is a review mentioned on tv-cards.com: http://www.thetechlounge.com/review....50_theater_pro

[e.lectronick]

first of all:
Satnav, Jonas,

Thanks for the links and the quotes from the other site on the new MMC. Heartening news, I must say. 'Course, I'm the eternal optimist. It's probably why I'm always so disappointed.
I suppose I should hang on a little while longer to see about 9.0.6 and it's TV Wonder compatibility. I too, think that the Elite must be considered a part of that same stable of horses.

Now to the title of this post:

I had a thought about the sync problem. Has anyone tried to capture ac3 streams with their video using a S/PDIF input jack on their soundcard? I just bought an M-Audio Audiophile 2496 for this purpose.

http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?s=&threadid=42568

http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?s=&postid=338286

My question would be whether this has any better results with audio sync? I should probably go look it up, but I wonder if an ac3 stream has any kind of timecode integrated into it which would facilitate it's matching to a video stream? Since it's already digital, that might make sense. Assuming no dropped frames on the part of the video capture, there may be no error in the sound speeding up or slowing down. Then, in a perfect world, the two should match up exactly, assuming they both start at the right time.

I'll dig around and see what I can find out.

-Erik

P.S. Oh, yeah. Another major benefit of capturing the digital stream would be the ability to preserve your 5.1 Dolby Surround. No small thing.

[e.lectronick]

For the record. I hate to be right about this stuff, but here's what I said about the lack of good software configurability before even the first review came out:

Just my 2 cents. But I have my ear to the ground and I guarantee you the reviewers are going to comment on this shortcoming. And when they do, you're going to lose half your buying audience. Is it really worth it?

and here's a quote from the very first review that came out:

"Once the software has been installed, it is time to set it up. I was really expecting to see more options within the software. Mainly I was looking for the location of saved video, the bit rate, and all the other great settings that come with such a powerful card. Apparently, I was very mistaken. The graphics are nice, but where are all the settings? Maybe they are further into the program after the initial setup? Nope. Apparently, the user doesn’t need this type of information. This complete lack of setup functionality seriously hurts this card in my opinion."

http://www.thetechlounge.com/review....ter_pro&page=2

"Can I get a 'HELL, YEAH!'?"
-John Chrichton

[jonaslasky]

That's the bad new.... the good news is that it IS possible to tweak all those settings...as weve seen with virtualVCR. Mr. Orr seems to promise that all those tweaks will be available with MMC 9.06

Jonas

[jonaslasky]

Now to the title of this post:

I had a thought about the sync problem. Has anyone tried to capture ac3 streams with their video using a S/PDIF input jack on their soundcard? I just bought an M-Audio Audiophile 2496 for this purpose.

http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?s=&threadid=42568

http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?s=&postid=338286

My question would be whether this has any better results with audio sync? I should probably go look it up, but I wonder if an ac3 stream has any kind of timecode integrated into it which would facilitate it's matching to a video stream? Since it's already digital, that might make sense. Assuming no dropped frames on the part of the video capture, there may be no error in the sound speeding up or slowing down. Then, in a perfect world, the two should match up exactly, assuming they both start at the right time.

But where is this digital stream coming from? aren't we talking about an analog tuner here? or are we talking about transfering video?

Your problem might actually be easier than you think. If you're able to convert your audio, then feed it through the S/PDIF, then VirtualVCR will do the rest for you. It even has an AV Syncher. But wait.... I wonder if it preserves the digital stream or does it convert it.... hmmm... I'll have to read up more about that

Jonas

[e.lectronick]

Sorry, I should've stated what sources I was referring to:

Either a Digital cable box with analog video out and S/PDIF digital audio out,
Or, from a Laserdisc player with rf output demodulated into ac3 audio stream (S/PDIF also).

[e.lectronick]

Jonas, I did read your earlier post about this. However, my comment was directed to the ATI guys who will be responding to our suggestions and queries about the T550P.
It's great that these things are possible with a third party's software, but ATI needs to know how we feel about issues over which they have control. Obviously, we want one program (MMC) which provides proper functionality for both software *and* hardware encode. I won't truly believe that 9.0.6 will do this until I see it for myself.
I don't know if you've noticed, but large organizations often need constant and repeated reminder of public opinion before changing course. (think drilling for oil in ANWR, and you've got it.). I'll keep pressing the point in the meantime.

That's the bad new.... the good news is that it IS possible to tweak all those settings...as weve seen with virtualVCR. Mr. Orr seems to promise that all those tweaks will be available with MMC 9.06

Jonas

[jonaslasky]

Sorry, I should've stated what sources I was referring to:

Either a Digital cable box with analog video out and S/PDIF digital audio out,
Or, from a Laserdisc player with rf output demodulated into ac3 audio stream (S/PDIF also).

In that case your problem is solved... if you have S/PDIF in on your sound card... then using VirtualVCR you can easily do this. You can even take care of whatever synch problem you might have. Assuming of course that AC3 is preserved.


But in the interest of keeping those ATI guys on their toes...
Do we have to resort to using a third party software to make all these things possible. Shouldn't MMC 9.06 include this feature (the ability to take audio through the S/PDIF input) ?

I agree with Erik of course that we should be unrelenting in putting pressure on ATI to give us a decent software product.

Jonas

[e.lectronick]

I wonder if it preserves the digital stream or does it convert it.... hmmm... I'll have to read up more about that

I'm not sure it does preserve it automatically. I believe the solution at Doom9 was that it required the use of hardware that could record the input without changing it (eg bit accurate digital input) and a software program that could save it as a .raw file. It would then be processed through BeSplit into it's proper .ac3 format ready for encoding with your video.

[e.lectronick]

In that case your problem is solved... if you have S/PDIF in on your sound card... then using VirtualVCR you can easily do this. You can even take care of whatever synch problem you might have.

Jonas

I'll need to check out VirtualVCR as I'm not familiar with it's use. I'm certain there are answers out there, but as yet nobody has made a guide to doing it from start to finish. Maybe when I finally decide which capture card to buy, I'll give it a go, myself.

I wonder how difficult it would have been to include a digital audio input on the 550 Pro based cards. It'd solve all of these problems.

-Erik.