New ATI Tuner Card.

[ron329]

My impressions with the new driver is that the sharpness has DECREASED ever so slightly, but it still quite good. Granted, I can't do side by side comparison, as there is a reboot in between, but these were my initial thoughts. If I could get rid of the pixelization I would still consider it flawless.

What I did to compare the 2 drivers was record a TV show with the original driver and then on the re-airing (some 5 hours later) recorded the same identical show on the same channel with the new driver. I then would watch each show in 5 minute increments and compare the results. It certainly appeared to me that the sharpness was better with the new driver and overall consistency was also better.

Let me know how you make out with the heat sink and if you see any improvement.

[satnav4]

My impressions with the new driver is that the sharpness has DECREASED ever so slightly, but it still quite good. Granted, I can't do side by side comparison, as there is a reboot in between, but these were my initial thoughts. If I could get rid of the pixelization I would still consider it flawless.

I didn't see any improvement in viewing picture quality with the new driver. I did not test encodes. I did notice some MMC functionality as commented above.

S.

[ciregnol]

What I did to compare the 2 drivers was record a TV show with the original driver and then on the re-airing (some 5 hours later) recorded the same identical show on the same channel with the new driver. I then would watch each show in 5 minute increments and compare the results.

Good thinking. My time to test is very limited, so, since the quality is very good, I'll forego it for now. If I have more time on the weekend, I may check it out.

[Question]

Hi all I’ve been waiting for the Theatre 550 Pro since its announcement.

I really wanted to play around with the comb filter to get a nice clean capture without the rainbow artifacts using external analog video connections.

And I’ve been reading this post for awhile and was exited about this chip so when I had the chance I purchased the ATI TV Wonder Elite.

So let me state I’m no expert but here is my opinion of the ATI TV Wonder Elites ability to use its 3D comb filter when capturing from the composite input.

I have come to the conclusion that the 3D Comb filter (the reason I purchased the card) in the TV-Wonder Elite is not functional when using the composite input.

I hope this is a driver problem and can be fixed in an updated driver.

My Test

Hardware:

ATI TV Wonder Elite
Canopus ADVC300
Pioneer CLD-D703 Laserdisc Player
Video Essentials Laserdisc

Software:
VirtualVCR Version 2.6.9 Build 6252
VirtualDub 1.6.4 Build 23174

Driver:
ATI Unified AVStream Driver Version 6.14.10.52 Dated 2/9/2005


ATI TV-Wonder Elite 3D Comb Filter Capture:

The CLD-704 was connected to the external A/V box by a Composite cable.

I turned off the Noise reduction filter in the ATI AVStream Analoge Capture Properties Dialog.

I made sure the Comb Filter was set to 3D and the Threshold was set to the default settings.

I captured the Snell and Wilcox SW2 NTCS from the Video Essentials Laserdisc
at 720 x 480 - 29.97fps YUY2 uncompressed In VirtualVCR.

I then opened the avi file in VirtualDub and saved out 2 frames one when the test pattern was moving and the other when the pattern was static (this should be were the 3D comb filter kicks in).


Canopus ADVC300 3D Comb Filter Capture:

The CLD-704 was connected to the ADVC300 by a composite cable then a s-video cable connected to the output of the AdVC300 was connected to the external A/V box of the TV-Wonder Elite.

I turned off the 2D & 3D Noise reduction filters in the Picture Controller 300 Application.

I made sure the Comb Filter was set to 3D and the Motion Detection was set to its default.

I captured the Snell and Wilcox SW2 NTCS from the Video Essentials Laserdisc
at 720 x 480 - 29.97fps YUY2 uncompressed In VirtualVCR.

I then opened the avi file in VirtualDub and saved out 2 frames one when the test pattern was moving and the other when the pattern was static.

Conclusion:

If you compare the 4 images of the 550 pro and ADVC300 you will notice that the 550 pro is not using its 3D comb filter.

The Snell and Wilcox SW2 NTCS test pattern is static except for the circular test pattern in the middle that moves around and stops periodically.

When I say a Moving frame I captured a frame when the circular test pattern was moving.

When I say Static frame I captured a frame when the circular test pattern was stopped.


If you look at the middle test pattern you will notice on the static frames the Rainbow Pattern almost disappear on the ADVC300 like they should if the 3D comb filter was functional but do not change on the 550 Pro.

This tells me that the 3D comb filter isn't functioning when using the external inputs and that the 2D comb filter is a poor implementation.

I've included a static image using the internal Three-line Digital Comb Filter inside the CLD-703 laserdisc player.

If you compare the 11 year old CLD-703's internal filter to the state of the art 550 Pro you could see it’s only slightly better.


ATI TV-Wonder Elite Pros and Cons

Pros:
Watch cable using the Cyberlink’s software. (I don't think so)
Upgrade my only PC to Windows XP Media Center 2005 (I have XP Pro and don't want to upgrade for $150 or more just to watch TV)
12bit decoder

Cons:
The first two Pros
No apparent 3D comb Filter support on external connection
Apparently a poor 2D comb Filter on external connection
3rd Party Software support (can't capture audio in VirtualVCR)

Images:

[img=http://img191.exs.cx/img191/5990/1snellandwilcoxsw2550promoving.th.jpg]
550 Pro frame with moving test pattern

[img=http://img191.exs.cx/img191/8810/2snellandwilcoxsw2advc300movin.th.jpg]
ADVC300 frame with moving test pattern

[img=http://img191.exs.cx/img191/2844/3snellandwilcoxsw2550prostatic.th.jpg]
550 Pro frame with static test pattern

[img=http://img191.exs.cx/img191/1798/4snellandwilcoxsw2advc300stati.th.jpg]
ADVC300 frame with static test pattern

[img=http://img191.exs.cx/img191/2449/cld703svideostatic9jw.th.jpg]
CLD-703 frame with static test pattern using s-video

[hrlslcbr]

@Michael:
Can you tell me what is the IRE setting the card is expecting when using video-in (composite and S-video)? For example, I have a DVD player with an option of 'black level', to set it to output IRE 0 or IRE 7.5. Hope I didn't confuse anyone.

[bubbaganoush]

Another issue with the 550:
I have 2 other tvs and the 550 split off a bi-directional amplifier. The signal on the 550 gets completely corrupted if one of the TVs is turned on.

[blakev]

I have come to the conclusion that the 3D Comb filter (the reason I purchased the card) in the TV-Wonder Elite is not functional when using the composite input.

I'm gobsmacked: thanks for sharing your most excellent test. I'm not surprised to see canopus outperform the 550: they don't compete in the same price range, after all. However, if you believe the hype, the 550 should be able to box above its weight and sway folks interested in canopus-style image quality.
Instead of that, what do we see? They didn't even finish the dev on one of the flagship features before thrusting this card on an unsuspecting public!

I'd love to know what our dear ATi lurkers think of your tests. I've seen people put up screen grabs, and frankly it's almost meaningless: too many variables in local signal strength and so on.

But the work you've done Question is solid and professional. Proves without a shadow of a rainbow artifact that ATi marketing ignored that the drivers for this card were nowhere near finished. Never mind the lack of info available to partners.

Theatre 550 Pro: great idea. But frankly, the card as it is today is an embarassment. I've never seen a company mess up a new product release as badly as this.

Unless you just want to watch TV on your PC. That's funny, isn't it? ATi throwing all its saavy at serving the college dormitory market. The laughs on us, of course, because ATi will recover their investment thanks to MCE.

I apologize in advance for being too cynical and perhaps upsetting people. But frankly, this card has gone from bad to worse to impossible.

I do hope ATi don't go the route of panic-stricken driver releases. These always cause more harm than good: especially to reputations.

Someone at ATi has to sit down somewhere quiet and finish the code: quite simple really: back to basics. What's the timeline for that, anyone?

Or is it worse than we suspect? Maybe the non-MCE market is too small to bother with, and we'll never see a proper driver? I mean a driver that implements correctly the ENTIRE hardware feature set and compatible software, as described by ATI marketing back when Myth started this thread.

I tell you, with this card, nothing is impossible! Even an ATi turnaround!

[satnav4]

MMC Update:

Recordings will have lipsync issues in addition to interlace artifact. I understand ATI's current position that MMC does not support the 550. I just wanted to make the point in case I misled anyone on the ability to limp along with a partially functioning MMC.

blakev:

You raise some good points. The big selling points for me (in addition to MMC support) were the 5 line 2D filtering, the 3D filtering and the hardware encoding. I had been on the fence about the Compro Ultra because of its 3D filtering capabilities, but it was a software encoder. The 550 seemed like the perfect product. If something can be done, I have faith Michael B will pass along the message to the ATI hierarchy.

S.

[satnav4]

Another issue with the 550:
I have 2 other tvs and the 550 split off a bi-directional amplifier. The signal on the 550 gets completely corrupted if one of the TVs is turned on.

I have a 3 way splitter and a 4 way splitter in line before the 550 gets the signal. I can have 2 tuners (Hauppauge 150's), a TV and the 550 all "on" at the same time without any corruption on the 550. I suspect there is something wrong with your splitter. If you are in the states, head to Home Depot and get a 1 gig splitter on a printed circuit board (pcb). I like the ones that state the decible loss per outlet. I stay away from the RCA and Philips splitters which are rather cheap, and could allow backwash.

I also recommend a ground breaker (XA-63400) to prevent ground loop interference and provide some surge protection. You can find them here:Home Tech

S.

[SHSPVR]

Question did you try iuVCR but if I recall rigth you need use the ATI AVStream Analog Audio Capture.
By the way any one know where get some free DVD Test Pattern so I can build my owe DVD like what Question sceeenshot that in full 720x480.

[hrlslcbr]

shs, try asking BJ_M on videohelp.com. I'm almost sure he can help you.

[jonaslasky]

I'm not at home so I can't try it yet, but I saw in another forum that Media portal has added support for the 550 pro. media portal "Added support for the 'ATI TV Wonder Elite' tv card "

Thanks thatdude... I'll try that.

Jonas

[satnav4]

Well, I've reverted back to my AIW 9800 Pro while I await word from Michael regarding the status of 550 support. The AIW continues to work acceptably with MMC support. It has the 3 spot; the Hauppauge 150 retail and mce have the 1 and 2 spots.

Has anyone gotten MediaPortal to work yet? Has anyone tried Intervideo's Theater program. After 2 XP install's last week after loading anything that might work better than Cyberlink, I am hesitant to try again.

S.

[wenis]

I may never buy another ATI product after following this card and this thread. They blundered the HDTV Wonder too!

[spacded]

wish they would just bring the UK PAL version out!!

[hrlslcbr]

While PowerLink PowerCinema software lacked functionality which was less than desirable, downloading ATI's Multimedia Center 9.03 gave us back the controls we seek to make the 550 Pro stand out with excellent control over the entire display range allowing user to manipulate the video experience and fine tune to anyone's liking.

I REALLY don't understand... They could make the card work well with MMC 9.03
http://www.mvktech.net/content/view/1243/0/1/0/